Community Submissions

Shaw versus Darmian

The desire for a Manchester United defender seems to be growing off the back of two clean sheets in the first two Gameweeks. While the fixtures may not be kind in the short term, that hasn’t stopped investment into a United backline that seems to be more solid with defensive midfielder Morgan Schneiderlin in front of them. While we attempt to save as much money where we can, and avoid players like Chris Smalling, who started in Fantasy Premier League (FPL) at 6.0, in favour of his cheaper counterparts, who should we be looking at – Luke Shaw or Matteo Darmian?

At the time of writing Darmian’s price in FPL had risen by 0.2 to 5.7 and probably means we’ll start seeing Shaw entering more teams. I still feel there is a discussion to be had, especially with the prospect of Shaw rising to 5.6, bringing them back to within 0.1 of each other.

Bonus Points

The initial thinking for most people is going to be Darmian; he should be less injury prone and less susceptible to rotation, and he looks more likely to pick up bonus points in FPL when United keep a clean sheet. But should we be ignoring Shaw?

If we look at the first two Gameweeks, Shaw received 26 and 28 points on the Bonus Point System (BPS), which is used by FPL to allocate bonus points. Meanwhile, Darmian gained 32 and 29. Darmian is the slight winner here but we also have to take into account he got a yellow card in the second match and still beat Shaw.

For clearances, blocks and interceptions (CBI), which contributes to a high BPS score for defenders, Darmian is also ahead with 18 versus Shaw’s 13. Currently, it does look like Darmian is going to win the battle for defensive points and the bonus points that come with them (though we do only have a small sample size).

Attacking Points

Attacking-wise, though, I feel Shaw has more potential. Granted, both of these two have started poorly in comparison to the likes of Manchester City’s Aleksander Kolarov when it comes to attacking stats but comparing the two of them makes for some interesting reading.

In terms of crosses Darmian actually wins again (three v zero for Shaw), and has also created a chance, whereas Shaw has created none. Where I feel the potential for better returns for Shaw are in touches in the final third. Shaw has nearly double the number of touches in the final third compared to Darmian: 47 v 24, and more in the opponents’ half: 87 v 53. With Memphis Depay potentially moving over to the left side for the majority of games from the number 10 role, we could see a lot of United’s attacks going down the left hand side and Shaw is likely to see more and more of the ball.

Looking at the heat maps for the first two Gameweeks Shaw’s average position is slightly higher up the pitch and he is seeing more of the ball. Whether he can turn that into assists and goals remains to be seen. The problem of Wayne Rooney also needs to be considered here. Even if Shaw is getting more of the ball and starts putting more crosses in who’s actually going to finish the chances? Rooney certainly looks lethargic in his play right now and is coming too deep for my liking.

Rotation Threat

Lastly is the competition for places. The main consensus is that Darmian has less competition for places, with only a makeshift right-back available in the form of Antonio Valencia competing for his spot, whereas Shaw has both Marcos Rojo and Daley Blind to contend with. As Fantasy Football Scout community member Van Klinkert Delarosa pointed out recently, it’s likely that Rojo or Blind will be deployed at left centre-back for the foreseeable future, which leaves only one other player fighting for a place at left centre-back or left-back. In that respect Shaw only really has one player fighting for his spot – a player that is also potentially fighting for the left centre-back position too. We also have to take into account that manager Louis van Gaal has had positive things to say about Shaw pre-season, although did hint at rotation.

I think that it shall be the season of Luke Shaw, that I believe. I believe in him and he has to feel that and I hope he shall show it. But he’s 20 years old. How many players of that age are playing in the Premier League?

 

Conclusion

I feel that Darmian is still the safer option and if the attacking returns remain as they are he’s more likely to pick up more Bonus Points in FPL based purely on defensive contributions. If Shaw can convert some of the possession he’s seeing into more chances then perhaps he can start coming out on top in terms of attacking points and will start to overtake Darmian in total points.

I’ve opted for Luke Shaw in my Wildcard. Am I looking into attacking potential that just isn’t there? Is there any reason to go for Shaw when Darmian seems to offer better defensive points potential? Will Darmian continue to pick up yellow cards or even a red when he faces Montero? Who will you go for?

42 Comments Post a Comment
  1. J0E
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 14 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Good comparison. Shaw certainly one to watch. Darmian the pick on current evidence though.

    1. Danno - Emre Canada
      • 9 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Lovely comparison and I have also opted for Shaw just for the reason as I think he plays higher up the pitch and this GW at least the opponents main right back is not playing and the week after Darmian is up against a tricky winger and Shaws ownership is lower were the only reasons for me. I can see it being a toss of a coin.

  2. Woy
    • 10 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Shaw went up that .1 last night if it affects anyones choice.
    Happy with Darmian on my WC though for now - it could be a close season between the 2 should they both get consistent minutes. Thanks for the article.

  3. FPL_Crisis
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 13 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    After the Newcastle game, I don't think a United defender is essential

    1. andy85wsm
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Agreed, and never said they were 🙂

    2. HVT
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      You gotta think there will be an increase in cs output the way they are setting up regardless of opposition-I do.

  4. OPTA FPL
    • 12 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Darmian has never got RC in his 4 years Torino career, never missed a game for Torino due to injuries

    1. andy85wsm
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Yeah - the thing about Montero and red card was a bit tongue in cheek after the Jaanmat incident and what he did to Ivanovic 🙂

      Probably should have left it out as it didn't come across that way.

  5. Alan-M
    • 9 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Shaw fitness...weight and injuries are a concern. He did look good first two GWs though.

  6. HVT
    • 13 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Nicely done Andy, fwiw I have Romero,Shaw and Darmian right now in my WC team!
    I'm edging to Darmian over Shaw based purely on the fact Lvg loves Blind and will try play him somewhere maybe up top instead of Rooney even, he looks competition to Shaw but maybe he makes cb his own-time will tell whereas I believe and always have even with Lvg bugging up Valencia that Darmian has nailed his spot,
    Thanks mate.

    1. andy85wsm
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Thanks HVT.

      I think it's pretty brave getting all 3! We certainly look like we're set up better defensively, Smalling and improved greatly over the last half of last season and looks to be turning into a strong CB. I'm not sure I'd plump for 3 though! Especially Romero who will be replaced if De Gea isn't sold.

      Good luck though, I love the flair! 🙂

      1. HVT
        • 13 Years
        8 years, 8 months ago

        Haha - trying to catch a few price rises methinks 😉
        Smalling deserves that mention I can't get over the improvement frankly, he's starting to boss games and he's looking fit and so conditioned right now, I can see him getting a few goals too from set pieces and baps will fall his way, I'm really hoping now that Chris can finally deliver the consistency that both he and United need.

  7. Ronnies
    • 8 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    WC team.... any suggestions welcome

    mcarthy (butland)

    darmian / kolarov / ward / (richards) (gomez)

    sanchez / yaya / depay / mahrez / (westwood)

    aguero / benteke / gomis

    is playing mcarthy & ward this gw palace overkill ?

    tnks guys

    1. Belalugozi78
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      I wouldn;t. they lost 6 out of 12 at home since Pardew took over

      1. Belalugozi78
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 9 Years
        8 years, 8 months ago

        6/11 even

  8. andyinasia
    • 10 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    I highly rate Darmian and he's my #2 choice defender. However, I've just taken him out of my WC squad as I've discovered a superb 4-way rotation.

    So Kompany is nailed on, and I can rotate 2 out of Swa/Sto/Lei/Cry.
    I started with Villa in stead of Swansea but found I could spend 5.0 to get Williams by downgrading Darmian to a 4.5

  9. Beavis
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 12 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    My 2 cents:

    - I prefer Darmian's consistency with the baps rather than the unpredictability of attacking points.

    - Darmian also has a better injury record.

    - And finally, in Shaw's best season 13/14 he managed 2 assists (none in 14/15 or 12/13). Darmian has got 3 (on two occasions) and 2 the other time. Granted though, Shaw is fast improving and is only young.

    1. HVT
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Agreed there is a huge improve factor there Beavis that we don't know of yet and I personally see that as improving in Shaws case.

    2. andy85wsm
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Thanks Beavis - I definitely think I need to do a bit more research before submitting.

  10. HVT
    • 13 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    It could also turn out like the Clyne/Bertie scenario we had last season when both yo yoed with additional attacking points besides cs.
    That was close on a draw points wise I recall.

  11. dharoc
    • 8 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Hi guys,
    Thoughts on team?
    Mata or Depay?
    Wilson & Mata – vs – Tekkers & Wanyama – vs – Sakho & Ayew?

    Ruddy - Butland
    Kolarov - Francis - Cedric - Richards - Ogbonna
    Mahrez - Sanchez - Silva - Mata - Chadli
    Agüero - Wilson - Diouf

  12. Ginkapo FPL
    • 12 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Why not both?

    1. FPL Puppy
      • 8 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Why both when you have the option to have another good defender from another team?

      1. Ginkapo FPL
        • 12 Years
        8 years, 8 months ago

        Because having both is better........

    2. andy85wsm
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Well that is indeed an option - the majority of people seem to be considering one or the other though.

  13. Barry Woj
    • 11 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Nice article, it would be interesting to know how often Shaw passes to Depay. I guess you imply it in the article, but to spell it out, given Depay's propensity to shoot from that left hand position, Shaw could well pick up a number of "assists" just by passing to him a la Gomez to Coutinho in GW1.

    1. Van Klinkert Delarosa
      • 9 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Taken from Villa v United stats:

      Shaw total passes : 43 successful from 48 passes. (10 to Memphis)

      Memphis total passes : 28 successful from 35 passes. (7 to Shaw)

      1. Barry Woj
        • 11 Years
        8 years, 8 months ago

        Cheers! A 5th of his attempted passes go to Memphis then, maybe I'll have to go for Shaw after all...

      2. Zizoulicious
        • 8 Years
        8 years, 8 months ago

        Where to you get these stats from?

        1. Van Klinkert Delarosa
          • 9 Years
          8 years, 8 months ago

          http://www.fourfourtwo.com/statszone

          The android version.

  14. Az
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 14 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    I've gone for Shaw.

    I like watching him play, whenever I've seen him he's looked really up for bombing forward and I think with Depay on the left now, he'll fashion a few chances for the winger which will hopefully get converted.

    5.5 is good value for Utd who look pretty woeful in attack, but solid at the back (albeit with relatively poor opposition thus far)

  15. Mr. Grv
    • 9 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    I have gone for shaw

    1. Mr. Grv
      • 9 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      and our avatars are same

      1. andy85wsm
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 13 Years
        8 years, 8 months ago

        Yeah - it's clear you need to change yours 😀

        1. Mr. Grv
          • 9 Years
          8 years, 8 months ago

          You might consider darmian :-!

  16. Bibelnissen
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 9 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Was waiting for this article since you announced it yesterday, Andy.

    I ran a comparison using the comparison tool and liked Shaw's numbers the best. Average position along with the huge difference in touches for both opponents half and final third indicates to me that Shaw is the most offensive, and therefore will be more likely to get assists.

    I was all set on going Shaw when he was 5.5, but I left him out of my WC team last night as no price predictors had him at 100% to give me another day of tinkering given I have money tied up with Darmian. Now Shaw's 5.6, the same price I bought Darmian for, and I'm not sure what to do anymore. If United stop keeping cleanies for their semi-tough fixture run I'd love that .1 buffer, or possibly .1 gained from another rise.

  17. Van Klinkert Delarosa
    • 9 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Cheers for the shout out, Andy. 🙂

    1. andy85wsm
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      8 years, 8 months ago

      Credit where it's due - I hadn't really thought about it that way.

      A new CB signing could change all that of course!

  18. asquishypotato
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 10 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Nice right up. Damian would currently be my choice, but if Shaw were to drop in price then he would be the one for me once United are fighting on less fronts.

  19. CPanc
    • 8 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    Andy great article. Looking to shaw for my wildcard also.

    Butland Ruddy
    Targett Shaw Gomez Kolorov Francis
    Silva Sanchez Ayew Ritchie Mahrez
    Aguero Gomis Diouf
    0.2 in Bank
    My team is still poor in terms of GK and defence. I feel rotation risk on shaw, kolorov and gomez.
    Also want Depay. About time for him to explode. Please help with suggestions.

  20. AK ⭐
    • 11 Years
    8 years, 8 months ago

    I really liked the neutrality of the article, Andy. Time and again I have seen people manipulating the stats to favour a particular player they fancy (Kolarov's Hot Topic being one of the cases, rightly pointed out by Cabaye4) while this takes up the Pros and Cons of both players.

    Coming back to the comparison. I am only going to work on the law of averages here and a few assumptions. This, by no means, is perfect or even anywhere close to being perfect, just some food for thought.

    I think we'd agree that United are going to improve on the defence this season and will probably keep more clean sheets than they did last season. Let's just take the number as 14. 14 clean sheets for United this season.

    Now Shaw managed 1 bonus point, while Darmian has managed 4 in 2 clean sheets. Following the law of averages, it comes out to be that Shaw will manage 7 Bonus points, while Darmian shold get 28.

    But then that's not a very likely scenario, so let's just say Darmian gets about 1 bonus point over Shaw every clean sheet. Which means in the next 12 clean sheets, Darmian will be better off Shaw by 12 points.

    That brings me to the question, do you think Shaw can compensate those points with his attacking output, also considering the fact that he is a slight rotation threat too which will lead to further difference in points with Darmian, do you think Shaw is worth 0.1 less than Darmian?

    Obviously, too many assumptions, small sample size and law of averages. It might not work out that way, and I am sure it won't, though still, as I said, food for thought