[sbu_large_image] Scout Reports
6 June 2015 935 comments
James Barnes James Barnes
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Earlier this week, Leicester City announced their first signing of the summer transfer window, snapping up Austria skipper Christian Fuchs on a three-year deal. Arriving at the King Power on a free transfer, the former Schalke left-back โ€“ who reportedly rejected interest from Swansea and Aston Villa โ€“ cited Foxes boss Nigel Pearson as pivotal to his decision:

“I think the philosophy of the coach fits me well. He gave me a nice phone call. He told me about the philosophy that Leicester are playing. He’s simply a very nice chap. He’s a cool guy. He said to me that he’s very personal โ€“ he knows how to handle the players on a personal level, and he also convinced me about Leicester. I followed them last season, and it was an impressive escape at the end. Everybody knows about it, everybody saw it and everybody’s talking about it โ€“ the great escape. I’ve seen other people working here, how they play, and it’s fun to watch.”

The History

Fuchs cut his teeth at local clubs SVg Pitten and Wiener Neustadt, before earning a move to Austrian Bundesliga outfit SV Mattersburg at the age of 18. Following a five-year stint that harvested 15 goals and 24 assists in 155 appearances across all competitions, the set-piece specialist made the switch to the top tier of German football, signing for Bundesliga outfit VgL Bochum.

Fuchs produced six goals and eight assists in 57 appearances over two terms at his new club, yet was loaned out to Mainz 05 in the 2010/11 season. After serving up eight assists in 33 appearances, he subsequently courted the attention of Schalke, signing a four-year deal that expired this summer.

In his first season at the club, Schalke won the DLL-Supercup, courtesy of a penalty shoot-out against Borussia Dortmund. His final season with Die Kรถnigsblauen served up three goals in 27 outings in all competitions, including a strike during Schalkeโ€™s 4-3 victory over Real Madrid in their Champions League quarter-final. The left-back managed eight goals and 30 assists in 136 matches for the Bundesliga outfit before signing on at the King Power Stadium.

Fuchs also boasts international pedigree. Since making his debut for Austria in a friendly match against Croatia nine years ago, heโ€™s chalked up 66 appearances for his country, registering a solitary goal along the way.

The Prospects

Versatile enough to operate on the left of a back-four or at left wing-back, Fuchs’ signing immediately casts doubts over Jeffrey Schlupp’s position at the King Power Stadium. With reports suggesting both Arsenal and Swansea are keeping tabs on Schlupp, the experienced Fuchs looks poised to oust the Ghanaian in Pearsonโ€™s first-team plans.

Akin to Schlupp, the Austrian defender would almost certainly be classified as a defender in the Fantasy Premier League (FPL) game, thus offering the same out-of-position potential for attacking returns, should Pearson continue to utilise the 3-4-1-2 formation that helped ensure Leicesterโ€™s survival last time out.

Fuchsโ€™ assist potential certainly bodes well on the Fantasy front. Renowned for his crossing ability, particularly from a dead-ball, the Austrian produced 33 key passes in the last Bundesliga campaign, averaging 1.3 key passes per appearance โ€“ as compared to Schluppโ€™s 0.7 in the Premier League. Furthermore, his frequency of chances created (one every 59 minutes) would have placed him second only to Leighton Baines (41.9 minutes) among the Premier League’s defender roster in 2014/15. Like Baines, Fuchs can also provide a potent threat from direct free-kicks.

To compound his appeal, the Foxesโ€™ rearguard is very much on our radars following their run of five cleans sheets in the final seven Gameweeks of last season. Given that Leicester ultimately finished the campaign with 55 goals against โ€“ the fourth worst defensive record in the Premier League โ€“ a price of 5.0 looks on the cards for their new recruit.

With points potential at both ends of the pitch, Fuchs could be poised to play a significant part in our five-man backlines for the season ahead. Summer appearances, offering clear indication of regular starts, could well ensure that Fuchs features heavily in the shake-up for our initial lineups.

Further Reference

Christian Fuchs Wikipedia

Christian Fuchs Transfer Markt Page

Christian Fuchs YouTube highlights

935 Comments Login to Post a Comment
  1. Defcons are for Kinnear
    • 12 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Who was MOTM? official and your own. I'm a bit stuck

    1. Defcons are for Kinnear
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      And no I will not apologise for top of the page. In fact a question like this deserves to be top of the page

      1. Camp No No
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        You're damn right there, mate.

    2. Epic Fail
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Nobody stuck out for me. Quite underwhelming.

    3. the axolotl
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      iniesta officially.

      i'd probably have given to neymar maybe, who i hate. nobody really stood out i suppose.

    4. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Have no idea of the official MOTM. My own, maybe Neymar. Or, this may sound wrong since he conceded three goals, but Buffon was pretty fine too.

    5. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I agree with this "nobody standing out", but to my mind it was because this was a generally strong match with tactical play ousting the individual performances. Everybody did a good job, despite the errors. They're going to happen when playing against players like these.

    6. Wilshere Knowledge
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      My MOTM would be Iniesta.

    7. dmcqt
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I'd go with Mascherano. Put in some amazing tackles and was strategically great. Messi, Suarez, and Neymar were all influential, but none of them had their best games.

  2. Dr Dream
    • 13 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Great final...

  3. La Roja
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Vermaelen ๐Ÿ˜†

    1. Ryan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      He won a trophy at least, thats why he moved right?

  4. Optimus.
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    The treble for Barcelona..At least Sanchez has his FA Cup winners medal to console himself with

    1. Wilshere Knowledge
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Better than Pedro's CL medal. ๐Ÿ˜‰

  5. John t penguin
    • 11 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Ok someone help me
    What odds do I need if I have £1.19 and want to make 10p more.

    1. Mull
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Sod that. Sell a kidney instead.

    2. Captain Shirokov
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Divide 1.29 by 1.19

      1. John t penguin
        • 11 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        What? Dogs don't do division
        Multiplication only

    3. the axolotl
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      119/10

      1. Wilshere Knowledge
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        10/119, no?

    4. the axolotl
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      actually 131/119

      1. the axolotl
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        what am i talking about. what i said before, but reverse as WK points out

    5. Epic Fail
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Look down the sofa.

      1. Camp No No
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        ˆthis ๐Ÿ˜†

  6. Defcons are for Kinnear
    • 12 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Neymar looks like the karate kid

    1. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      ๐Ÿ˜€

  7. Davido989
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Absolute delighted for Suarez. Karma hits twice as hard, Evra.. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    Brilliant final. Best team in the world by far.

    1. Comment removed. Please refer to our terms and conditions on posting comments.

      1. Davido989
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Suarez is my favourite player in the world.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          But... he's such a tw@t....

          1. Davido989
            • 15 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            A world class tw@t!

            1. Wilshere Knowledge
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              But if it's just the fact that he's good that makes you like him, there are better players than him?

              1. Davido989
                • 15 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Only messi are ronnie are better than him

                1. Wilshere Knowledge
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  If you think that, then shouldn't Messi and Ronaldo be your favourite players? ๐Ÿ˜€

                  1. Davido989
                    • 15 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    Favourite doesn't mean best, wilsh! ๐Ÿ˜›

                    1. Wilshere Knowledge
                      • 12 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      Yeh, so why is he your favourite, if it isn't just about quality of player?

                      What redeeming qualities makes him your favourite? (Genuinely curious)

                      1. Davido989
                        • 15 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        Someone different to the usual 2

                        Best number 9 in the world

                        Played for lfc

                      2. Wilshere Knowledge
                        • 12 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        Okay, fair enough. ๐Ÿ™‚

                        Wilshere is the best player after Messi and Ronaldo btw. ๐Ÿ˜‰

    2. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Well not by far, for sure. This was actually pretty tight.

      1. Davido989
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Buffon showed why he is one of the all time greats. 2 top teams

          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Mistake for Suarez's goal mind you.

    3. HVT
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Evras not a racist tho.

      1. Davido989
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        still a moronic child

        1. HVT
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 15 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          They all are.

    4. Doosra - โ˜ญDeclanMyGeniusโ…
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      What utter bollocks. ๐Ÿ™‚

  8. Defcons are for Kinnear
    • 12 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    I'd rate that final 7.5/10

    1. Defcons are for Kinnear
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I would've rated higher if Juve didn't get the blatant penalty robbed. That spoiled it. Otherwise very enjoyable

      1. Camp No No
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Exactly, exactly!!! It was a stonewall penalty there, and minute after it Barcelona scored 2-1.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          The Alves on Pogba incident? Never a penalty... Pogba off balance and already going down, minimal contact.

          1. Camp No No
            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Clear penalty, arms around him, dragging the guy down. "Stonewall" is exaggeration, but "minimal" contact is an outright lie.

            1. Wilshere Knowledge
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              Pogba was off balance and already going down. Never enough contact for a penalty! ๐Ÿ˜€

              (I wanted Juve to win btw)

  9. HVT
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Take out that frontline and they're crap.

    1. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      True. And take out just one man, anyone, from that frontline, and they're not extraordinary.

      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Take any team's three best players out of the team and they'd all be crap?

      Stooopid argument.

      1. Nickofoz
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 11 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        this

      2. HVT
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        It's a statement from my PoV Guy.
        Most teams would dream of one of those three in their team.
        Liverpool did and see where it nearly got them. He nearly carried that team to Epl.

    2. Wilshere Knowledge
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Any team would struggle with 8 players tbf.

      1. Mull
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        ๐Ÿ˜†

    3. Davido989
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      what a hideous comment

    4. The Machine
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Loooool people actually biting

      1. HVT
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        ๐Ÿ˜‰

  10. Gamst - Up (?) the Rovers
    • 16 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Pique cutting down the goal net with scissors!

    1. Gamst - Up (?) the Rovers
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Been at it for 5 minutes with the doc's scissors.

    2. Ryan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Such a waste. Would be difficult to put up again.

  11. Ryan
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Why are the Barcelona players cutting down the goal net. Do the not know how to take it down properly

      1. The Bandit
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Nice, good to know I can get away with criminal damage and theft if I call it tradition ๐Ÿ˜‰

        1. John t penguin
          • 11 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Mobs in London riots should do it again this year and try claiming that

          1. Ryan
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • Has Moderation Rights
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            It actually could be used as a legitimate defence in court depending on how strong the tradition is. I'm sure stuff like this happens all over the world.

      2. Ryan
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I can understand if they were to reuse it and put it up again on a training pitch goal, but otherwise I'm somewhat baffled

          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Yeah, not sure what he does with it when he gets it home! A memento I guess.

          1. Ryan
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • Has Moderation Rights
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Does he hang it on the wall? lol

    1. The Bandit
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      To sell in bits on ebay

    2. Rupert The Horse
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 13 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      It's a Pique thing.

  12. Bøwstring The Carp
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Pique taking the net to put his bonus in ๐Ÿ˜†

    Dunphy you legend ๐Ÿ˜€

    1. HVT
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Looks tacky

    • 12 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Stupid from Dixon to suggest the Neymar handball should stand. ๐Ÿ™„

    1. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      But are you surprised?

        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        True! ๐Ÿ˜›

    2. The Machine
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Lol yeah. The discussion shouldnhave ended when it was obvious his hand totally changed the direction of the ball

    3. Wilshere Knowledge
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Shouldn't it actually be a goal, technically?

      Not intentional, hard to argue his arm was in an unnatural position...

      It shouldn't be a goal, but with the rules as they currently are, it is, no?

      1. The Machine
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        The rules dont say it has to be intentional.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          So why wasn't the cross that hit the Juventus' players arm in the first half, with his arms by his side, a penalty?

          What is the exact rule that meant it was a handball? I always thought the criteria was either intention, or unnatural position of the arm.

          1. Camp No No
            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            • the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)

            makes it deliberate regardless of the intention that cannot be known. The "unnatural position" comes more in consideration if the hand is not moved, say, if player spreads his arms to cover more space, but is not precisely moving his hand when ball is shot to it.

      2. Ryan
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        No because the hand altered the direction of the ball. You can't score with you hands regardless anyway.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          But almost every ball that hits an arm changes the direction of the ball, and not every ball that hits an arm is a handball.

          And I don't think there is any rule that makes a distinction based on the result of a 'handball'...

          1. Ryan
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • Has Moderation Rights
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Consistently penalties are given if the arm does significantly alter the direction of the ball. The same principal should apply here and it couldn't be more obvious imo, its not even a marginal decision. I would expect it to be refereed in the spirit of the game rather than nit picking on the debatable criteria of the rules.

            1. Wilshere Knowledge
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              I agree on your last point, I just think the rules should be corrected. The fact that the officials could be heavily criticised for simply enforcing the rules of the game is unfair on them, and it's bad for the game. ๐Ÿ™‚

              1. Ryan
                • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                • Has Moderation Rights
                • 14 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Fair enough, I think its a really difficult thing to word well without adverse consequences. The whole deliberate thing has its place but I can understand it not being particularly adequate. I just wouldn't expect referees to take things too literally when applying the rules when its a difficult rule to define anyway.

        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I don't think the rules are really relevant, whatever they say.

        It's about consistency... There are loads of handballs, but how many are actually *deliberate* as per the dictionary definition? Not many, I'd say.

        So the 'deliberate' thing is nonsense most of the time. They just get hung up on that for big decisions. The way games are refereed, that's a handball imo.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          I know, but if the rules aren't doing the business, or leave too much ambiguity, then surely they just need revision?

          I'd say maybe it should be added that it is deemed handball if a player is significantly advantaged by it. That should fix most problems.

            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Yeah, not a bad tweak to be fair. Wilsh for FIFA President!!

            1. Wilshere Knowledge
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              Thanks, but I already voted for Gunnersaurus! ๐Ÿ˜€ ๐Ÿ˜‰

      3. Camp No No
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Intentionality has little to do with it being a foul. A moving (or even just out reached) hand touching the ball, intentional or not, is a foul.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Is that the rulebook definition of a handball, or just the commonly understood rule?

          1. Camp No No
            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            It is in the interpretation of the laws of the game, the referee guide, which is what you should read to understand what "deliberate" means. Moving hand towards the ball equals "deliberately playing the ball with hand". End of story.

            1. Wilshere Knowledge
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              Yeh, moving the hand towards the ball is handball, but that's not what happened in Neymar's case.

              He hand was in a normal position, and he headed it onto his own hand. There is no way he headed the ball and then tried to use his hand to change the direction of the ball on purpose.

              1. Ryan
                • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                • Has Moderation Rights
                • 14 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                What is a normal position? I'd say that is debatable

                1. Wilshere Knowledge
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  By normal position I just mean it wasn't in a position whereby the use of the hand was premeditated.

                  If it as in fact he meant to head it onto his own hand, that would be very impressive! ๐Ÿ˜†

                  1. Camp No No
                    • 12 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    But that is not the issue. For example, the defenders, when sliding to block cross/shot quite naturally stretch their arm behind them to support their move, but still, if that arm is hit by the ball, by the current official interpretation of the laws of game, it is a foul.

                    In fact, if he intentionally used his hand to score the goal, it would have been a more sever foul, and he would be cautioned or even sent off.

                    1. Twisted Saltergater
                      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                      • 16 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      The referee is interpreting the outstretched arm as a deliberate act to help him block the shot.

                      A player is only sent off for handball if it denies a goal scoring opportunity (typically this can only be judged if a player handles on the line).

              2. Camp No No
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                But see, his hand was in a position where it is far from his body and can easily be hit by the ball, and indeed _was_ moving upwards, that is, on the way of the ball. This is really a non-debate. Even if it is arguably "normal" or "natural" for a player to move his arms high like that when moving, he takes the risk that if the ball hits his arm, or hand, then it is a foul.

                1. Wilshere Knowledge
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  Without detachment of limbs all together, there is always a 'risk' of it hitting an arm. The potential for it hitting arms does not create intentionality. Nor can you say it is handball due to undue care of arm placement because of their basic function as devices for balance and momentum.

                  If the prescription for handball is just intentionality as put forward by the rules, then that is all that matters. Conscious foresight, premeditation are the only things that matter.

                  1. Camp No No
                    • 12 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    The rules have nothing about intentionality, ffs! Okay, I stop here, good night.

          2. Camp No No
            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Basically, it is deliberate if player is not trying to avoid touching the ball or could not avoid it, which implies previous acts, so if he moved his arm in a position where it could more easily be hit by the ball, he is also guilty (that's the unnatural position part of the rule).

            1. Ryan
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • Has Moderation Rights
              • 14 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              In which case his arm was in an unnatural position as it was very close to his head and shouldn't 'normally' interfere with the flight of the ball as it left his head towards the goal.

              Therefore it was a handball due to hand being in an unnatural position.

              1. Camp No No
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Or because of moving on balls trajectory. Either one goes, really. But a clear hand ball in any case.

          1. Pasqualinho
            • 16 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Surprised me - more talk about 'unnatural positions' here:

            http://www.sportskeeda.com/football/understanding-handball-rule-what-is-deliberate-offense-what-is-not

            But the rules do say deliberate. I myself have given away a number of penalties for handball. I can honestly say that they all hit my hand, but never once was I trying to deliberately block the ball with my hand. Seems a bit confusing.

            1. Twisted Saltergater
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • 16 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              Yep, a referee has to judge a deliberate act so there's always going to be grey areas, and therefore inconsistent decisions.

          2. Camp No No
            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            You mistake "deliberation" for "intention".

            1. Twisted Saltergater
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • 16 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              An intentional handling of the ball is a deliberate handball and therefore a foul. Not intending to handle the ball can still be a foul if the referee interprets the player as intentionally handling the ball.

              Not sure what distinction you're trying to make?

              1. Camp No No
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                No. Your mistake is this: intentional handling, of course, is deliberate, but unlike you seem to think, this doesn't exhaust all cases counted as deliberate. It is enough that the player moves his hand on balls trajectory, or towards the ball, even accidentally, to make it deliberate. I repeat myself from above:

                it is deliberate if player is not trying to avoid touching the ball or could not avoid it, which implies previous acts, so if he moved his arm in a position where it could more easily be hit by the ball, he is also guilty (that's the unnatural position part of the rule).

                Your second point makes little sense, if any.

                1. Twisted Saltergater
                  • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                  • 16 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  You've lost me. A referee is asked to interpret whether a handball is deliberate or not. Whether it was deliberate only the player knows.

                  A defender charging down the ball with his arms in the air and being struck with the ball will in some cases be a penalty and in other cases not be a penalty. The defenders isn't automatically penalised because his arms were there or because he didn't move his arm.

                  1. Camp No No
                    • 12 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    But it should be penalised every single time. Yes. It should. By the laws of the game.

                    1. Camp No No
                      • 12 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      If happening as you described.

                      And you're still confusing deliberate and intentional.

                    2. Twisted Saltergater
                      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                      • 16 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      No it shouldn't, and I'm not confusing anything!

                    3. Twisted Saltergater
                      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                      • 16 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      As an example, let's say a player in the box turns to the ref with his arms in the air appealing an earlier decision. Play goes on and a crossed ball hits his outstretched arms while the player is still protesting. He hasn't even seen the cross and isn't watching the play.

                      That is not a penalty by the rules of the game. You're saying it's a penalty because his arms are in an unnatural position. It was not deliberate.

                      1. Camp No No
                        • 12 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        That's a strange situation, but by laws of the game a penalty if he moves his hand in front of the ball. Shouldn't fecking protest.

                    4. Camp No No
                      • 12 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      Intentionality is a question of what player intends to do, is his intention to handle the ball and do something with it by his arms. Deliberation as in FIFA's rules is brought down to things such as "position of the arm" and "hand moving towards the ball". Referee doesn't have to know players intention. It is enough that he sees that the player moves his hand - that is deliberate - to a position where it eventually is touched by the ball - that is playing ball with hand.

                      1. Twisted Saltergater
                        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                        • 16 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        You don't understand "deliberate" ... arms move deliberately all the time. Deliberate in this sense is purely the referee interpreting whether the player INTENTIONALLY put his arm there to gain an advantage... cleverly, slyly or otherwise.

                        Defenders charging out with their arms up, may not be intentional but looks that way to the ref, so he deems it deliberate handball and a foul.

                        Neymar was penalised because his arm was near his head when the cross came in. The 4th official interpreted this as a deliberate handball regardless of whether Neymar intended it or not, as a player's arm would normally be lower.

    4. HVT
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Pundits generally like a little controversy

  13. Sif
    • 13 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Still no Neymar goal added, up there with Fantasy World Cup.

  14. The Bandit
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    I once had a lower round score than Tiger Woods. Life complete

    1. John t penguin
      • 11 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      My wife once put a club through my car window
      I am only on par with him

  15. John t penguin
    • 11 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Oh the irony
    Just got arrested for stealing dentastix
    Got on the spot fine of £1.19

    1. Camp No No
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      ๐Ÿ˜€

    2. The Bandit
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Chin up, would be £1.29 later

    3. Doosra - โ˜ญDeclanMyGeniusโ…
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Chew on that! ๐Ÿ˜‰

    4. Gamst - Up (?) the Rovers
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Stealing? Didn't you explain to them that you checked your run, slipped and landed outside the store with said stolen goods?

  16. Davido989
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Patrice Evra is the first player to lose the Champions League final with three different clubs.

    1. The Bandit
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I suspect he is in a very small group who have made it to the final with 3 different teams

      1. Davido989
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Yep achievement in itself but I am a pessimist

          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Yeah, I'd be pretty gutted to lose 4 out of 5 finals.

        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        They said beforehand only Maldini has got to more finals (6). Obviously all with the same club.

  17. The Pep Revolution
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    So is Pogba worth 60 to 70 million or overhyped in your opinion?

      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Had a decent game, tbh. Huge potential.

      1. The Pep Revolution
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Yeah great potential. That will increase the fee but looks worth it.

    1. The Bandit
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      None of the options

      1. The Pep Revolution
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I only said 60 to 70 million because they are the figures being talked about. Maybe a better question would have been how much do you think he is worth?

        1. The Bandit
          • 15 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Who knows, currently maybe 30m but no way over hyped. Gonna be huge

          1. The Pep Revolution
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Yeah a lot of the transfer fee will be for potential. Looked good tonight.

    2. SuperDunny - Used to be goo…
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Just gonna get better and better

      1. The Pep Revolution
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        True, certainly one for the future.

    3. Defcons are for Kinnear
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I thought he looked great with a lot of potential. The price is due to

      - lack of top class complete CMs
      - Age as he provides you with years of service and can improve further
      - looks like he could be a real scruff of the neck player (I've only seen him today in a full match)

      1. The Pep Revolution
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        True would be a long term investment. Will be some player in time. Already looking impressive.

    4. Wilshere Knowledge
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      A very good player, but from what I've seen, he isn't an exceptional technician.

      In today's market, perhaps £35-£50m would be fair.

      1. The Pep Revolution
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Great pace though. Id guess it will be 50 million, if not a little more.

        1. Wilshere Knowledge
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          I imagine he'd certainly cost more, but I'd say that's about fair value. (That would be based on a base value where I think Alexis Sanchez is a £30m player.)

          1. The Pep Revolution
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Fair enough. He will be a great addition to whatever team he joins, will probably have his pick of many.

  18. Davido989
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Thomas Vermaelen has more trophies (3) than appearances (1) with Barcelona.

      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      And an extra few million in the back pocket. Not bad.

    1. Ryan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Thats an amazing success rate

    2. Gamst - Up (?) the Rovers
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Pound-for-pound the best player ever.

  19. the axolotl
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    great to see a great like xavi win a final champs league medal, before embarking to qatar to live off the back of slaves for 3 years of easy money.

    #lostallrespectforhim

      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      lol

  20. AIRMILES
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Still waiting for £50 risk-free bet to be returned on 365.

    1. andy85wsm
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Takes a while

      1. AIRMILES
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Yep. first leg of semi finals I waited about 2 hours for it, but then refunded instantly on second leg. Just makes me a little nervous. However, going out to spend my 3-1 winnings in the pub.

        See you anon.

    2. Epic Fail
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      It's a scam.

    3. Pasqualinho
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      within 2 hours of the final whistle, so they say. I'm interested to see if Tony Hibbert's Vermaelen method works.

  21. Defcons are for Kinnear
    • 12 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Why the montage from ITV? Are they not showing highlights next season?

      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      After 23 seasons, ITV’s live rights to the Champions League comes to an end on Saturday night with the final in Berlin
      http://www.theguardian.com/football/2015/jun/06/itv-farewell-champions-league-10-moments-to-remember

      apparently so... didn't realise that.

      1. Defcons are for Kinnear
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        ๐Ÿ˜ฅ

  22. JJO
    • 13 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Have to say this here
    Im not a fan of Busquets but think he was maybe a best player tonight
    61/63 passes 97%
    And normally I cant stand that kind of players

    1. The Bandit
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      How many of them were over ten yards?

      1. JJO
        • 13 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Big percent of those passes were up the field through 2 players
        Not like Carricks ones
        And he was always present in defence and good positioning

      2. Dr Dream
        • 13 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        To be fair that's probably expected at Barca....He may even get sacked if he tried pinging 40 yard passes.

        1. The Bandit
          • 15 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          True, but does that make him motm?

          1. Dr Dream
            • 13 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Did he get it ?...surely not.....He wasn't anywhere near it if he did.

    2. the axolotl
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      don't agree. don't like him much either although i do rate him. but pass %s are a fairly useless statistic in my book. just means you're a risk-averse (throughball-averse) conservative sideways passer. not to say that's not needed too, but still a meaningless statistic.

      1. Ryan
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I think its more meaningful when dismissing really bad players with terrible pass %'s For a top player though I agree, it becomes less relevant.

      2. JJO
        • 13 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I dont usually look at statistics and never was a person who is affected by it
        But I watched a game and see a lot of his passes going to attack and have to see statistics
        I havent even seen those 2 incorect passes,thought he has s perfect game
        A lot more riskier passes then Xavi have in his games last few seasons
        If Xavi had a game like that everyone eould mention it

        1. the axolotl
          • 14 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          yeah, you're probably right there. it's just that i'd imagine players like messi would have rubbish %s because they're constantly on the edge of almost pulling off a throughball that might lead to a goal, but most of time it doesn't quite come off. but when it does it's a goal, rather than possession 5 yards to the left in midfield

          1. JJO
            • 13 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Absolutly agree with that
            And as I said I almost never look at statistics,its not relevant in football fo me
            From all those barcas players even including those that came from bench Busquets is the player I least admire and love to watch but think he did his job perfectly

    3. Dr Dream
      • 13 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Look at Busquets trophy cabinet..it's bulging at the seams.

      1 World Cup
      1 European championship
      5 La Liga's
      3 Champins league....can't be bothered writing the rest, but he's only about 27.

      1. the axolotl
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        ๐Ÿ™‚

        1. the axolotl
          • 14 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          ๐Ÿ™‚
          some decent busquets bashing on tonight .

          he did have a good game go tbf as per jjo's original point

  23. Davido989
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Xavi at Barcelona:

    La Liga x 8
    UCL x 4
    Copa del Rey x 3
    UEFA Super Cup x 2
    FIFA Club World Cup x 2

    Fitting way to leave. A true great. ๐Ÿ™‚

    1. Epic Fail
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Fluke.

    2. Mull
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      No Europa League though. Overrated.

    3. Cpt Crunch Scott talent
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Mediocrity lust be driven out of Europe, Qatar suits him...

    4. The Machine
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      But can he do it on a cold windy night in stoke?

      1. The Bandit
        • 15 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        The number of players who gave done it more on a cold windy night in Stoke is staggering. Definitely Average at best

    5. copps
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      never mind the euros and world cup

  24. Wilshere Knowledge
    • 12 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    If of interest to anyone.

    From the extended PDF guidance from http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/laws/football-11-11/law-12---fouls-and-misconduct.aspx

    Handling the ball involves a deliberate act of a player making contact with
    the ball with his hand or arm. The referee must take the following into
    consideration:
    • the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)
    • the distance between the opponent and the ball (unexpected ball)
    • the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an
    infringement
    • touching the ball with an object held in the hand (clothing, shinguard, etc.)
    counts as an infringement
    • hitting the ball with a thrown object (boot, shinguard, etc.) counts as an
    infringement

      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I'd love to know who decided they needed to legislate for potential shinpad ball striking!

      1. Wilshere Knowledge
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I can just imagine someone turning up to a Sunday league game with cricket pads and batting a couple corners in! ๐Ÿ˜†

      2. the axolotl
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        lol. maybe it happened somewhere, some chancer probably scored with his shinpad and they were powerless to rule it out.

    1. the axolotl
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      it's a rule that needs way way more clarity. probably the single most argued about decision (except maybe offside?).

    2. Twisted Saltergater
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Look up

      1. Wilshere Knowledge
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Yeh mate, should have given you credit. I clicked your link and downloaded the PDF.

        Thanks TS! ๐Ÿ˜€

        1. Twisted Saltergater
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 16 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Haha nice one ๐Ÿ˜€ just did a google search myself

    3. Ryan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      How is this a definition? it couldn't be more ambiguous

      'the position of the hand does not necessarily mean that there is an
      infringement'

      1. Ryan
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        It really is left up to the referee's discretion then. And tbf I'd trust a referee's judgement over these said rules.

      2. Wilshere Knowledge
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        I think it means that whatever position the hand is in, it doesn't necessarily follow that it was intentional. This discards my held idea that 'unnatural position' is a part of the rules.

        It seems intentionality is in fact all that matters.

        1. Ryan
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 14 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          So its not necessarily an infringement but still might be an infringement. The phrase 'not necessarily' is neither yes or no, it can go either way. Ambiguity at its finest.

          I think we should accept that its really up to the referee to make a judgement. There is no hard and fast rule, the rules are deliberately grey and flexible.

          1. Wilshere Knowledge
            • 12 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            No, it just means that position of the hand doesn't on it's own prescribe intentionality.

            ie, the position of the hand can be an infringement if the handball is intentional, but an identical hand position isn't an infringement if the handball wasn't intentional.

            Obviously the nature of intentionality relies on the subjective opinion of the referee, but the Neymar handball almost certain wouldn't be deemed intentional. He wouldn't have headed it at his ow hand afterall.

            1. Ryan
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • Has Moderation Rights
              • 14 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              You might be right there. So perhaps it was given hand ball for another reason. See above.

              1. Wilshere Knowledge
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                "Therefore it was a handball due to hand being in an unnatural position."

                This^ ?

                I can only reiterate my point. An unnatural position of the arm can be a preceding factor to both an intentional, and unintentional handball.

                1. Camp No No
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  Man, you're basing your whole interpretation on a factor that doesn't even exist in the laws of the game. Different things are taken into account, together, but intention is one that is pretty rare and only makes the foul greater. It is not required for the foul.

                  1. Wilshere Knowledge
                    • 12 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    I'm basing it on the word deliberate. Deliberate = intention, by colloquial and dictionary definition.

                2. Ryan
                  • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                  • Has Moderation Rights
                  • 14 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  I don't agree with your answer. I think Camp sums it up well below

            2. Twisted Saltergater
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • 16 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              Neymar had his hand there for insurance, should he miss the header. Correct decision reached.

              1. Camp No No
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Hah. Probably so, in fact.

                1. Twisted Saltergater
                  • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                  • 16 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  Well we know that's exactly what the 4th official thought, otherwise the goal would've been given. He interpreted the handball as a deliberate act on the part of Neymar.

            3. the axolotl
              • 14 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              i think you've articulated the problem pretty well there.

              the rule should be something like;
              -intentional handball is a foul (obviously)
              - and basically something about having it in such a position that it's blocking a shot/cross, but the hand position would need to be a certain distance from the body.

              1. Ryan
                • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                • Has Moderation Rights
                • 14 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Assuming a normal position is hands at one's side. Then anything other than that is perhaps guilty of a hand ball?

                1. the axolotl
                  • 14 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  yeah i don't even agree with that:-)

                  nobody runs with their hands by their sides for instance or jump that way for that matter. it's a difficult thing to legislate for i suppose, just think they can improve on what they have now

                  1. Ryan
                    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                    • Has Moderation Rights
                    • 14 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    Thats what I'm saying, its impossible to make it black and white. A natural or normal position is all you can do but it will always be open to debate. Was Naymars hands in a natural position?

                    Just leave it up to the referee I say, if its debatable then the rules can't really clarify it. Someone has to make a call at the end of the day.

                    1. the axolotl
                      • 14 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      agreed

            4. Camp No No
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              You still confuse deliberate with intentional when rules have nothing about intentional. It doesn't matter whether the player intends to play the ball with his arm or not. What matter is whether he deliberately makes a move that risks his arm touching the ball. Which is something Neymar did by moving his hand up like that. It is never a question of whether he intended to touch the ball with his hand or not.

              Let me put it this way: suppose he only tried to head the ball, but would have missed it and accidentally then directed the ball to the goal with his hand. Are you saying it wasn't a hand ball then?

              1. Wilshere Knowledge
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Intention: a thing intended; an aim or plan
                Deliberate: done consciously and intentionally

                They are synonyms. Enter either into a thesaurus, and both ways the other appears as a substitute.

                I don't understand what definition you are using to draw a distinction.

                Deliberate is the same as intention. If they position their arm because they think it might work in their favour, that is intentionality.

                I just find it strange that you think Neymar intended that in any way. If you do, then we can say we agree on the application of the rules, but just disagree in our subjective perception of events. ๐Ÿ™‚

                1. Camp No No
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  Firstly, they are not the same thing even in general. They come close, that much is true, but it doesn't mean they're the same for most technical purposes, say, law. Secondly, we're talking exactly about a technical issue of law here. Word deliberate is defined by the guide of interpretation. It is same with all law: it is not by the dictionary, but by the text books, statutes and the case law that you learn the meaning of the terms. There is no instance in the FIFA laws of the game where the ref is told to consider whether the player intended to make that specific touch to the ball with their arm in that situation, only that he deliberately played in a way that caused him to have the ball against his hand.

                  1. Twisted Saltergater
                    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                    • 16 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    That is EXACTLY what a referee is being asked to do. Deliberate handball isn't like scoring a goal or not... it isn't black and white. It needs the referee to consider intention.

                    Where intention is difficult to determine, a referee uses common sense to question whether the player may have cleverly had his arms out stretched, and therefore it was deliberate.

                    It's a grey area and therefore some people will think the player didn't intend to handle it, while others think he did because of the arm being in an unnatural position.

                2. Camp No No
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  And players may position their arm in a way that it gets easily hit by ball for reasons having nothing to do with it, say to keep their balance, and yet it is a foul if they then get the ball in their arm. Good example are the defenders sliding in front of the ball to block it, who often have to stretch their arm behind them and just risk it being hit by the ball without really intending to block it with arm. And it is a foul.

                3. Camp No No
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  Finally, I do not care about Neymar's intention with playing his hand like that and I do not think it is relevant. He deliberately moved his hand upwards and got the ball to it, and that is a foul regardless of why he did it - that we cannot know. End of story. So I don't agree about application of rules, but I guess I agree about perception of events.

                  And you didn't answer my question above, and you should also watch it again, because, as I noted, Neymar does move his hand on the way of the ball, so the movement point applies here.

                  Good night for the second time, this time for real.

                  1. Wilshere Knowledge
                    • 12 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    I will respond one more time, if only for the purpose of those who might stumble upon this discussion.

                    "Word deliberate is defined by the guide of interpretation."

                    Identifying something as deliberate is interpretation, but not the act itself.

                    "Firstly, they are not the same thing even in general."

                    You have made no attempt to draw any distinction. Thus you are trying to argue based on nothing but your say so.

                    "it is not by the dictionary, but by the text books, statutes and the case law that you learn the meaning of the terms."

                    Again, you still fail to draw any distinction. You seemingly make the claim that there is a difference, without any reference to the source of the reason, the nature of their difference, or the reason for their difference.

                    Your entire argument is based on a distinction between 'deliberate' and 'intention.' It is an distinction that hold no logical sense in congruence with the English language, it makes no logical sense within a philosophical context, it makes no sense in a neurological context, it makes no sense in a cognitive psychologists framework.

                    Unless you can make this distinction, which I say you cannot, you have no ground for argument.

                    If doing something deliberate is doing something intentional,
                    And the laws of football say a foul is based on whether something is deliberate,
                    then doing something intentionally is a foul.

                    If you have no ground on which you can argue against the premises, you are rationally bound to accept this deduction.

                    Good night!! ๐Ÿ˜€

          2. Pasqualinho
            • 16 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            For me, when I ref a game I just go on whether a player has benefited from the infringement. The arm/hand is not allowed to play the ball, so if a player controls a ball with his hand, accidental or otherwise, I give a free kick - if his arm/hand wasn't there he wouldn't have controlled it. If a shot hits an outstretched arm, it's a free kick or penalty - if the arm wasn't there it wouldn't have been stopped. But if a player's protecting his face from a close range shot he's gaining no advantage (not in a sporting sense - maybe for preventing a broken nose). That's my interpretation of the 'unnatural position' phrase - and I'm sticking to it. Although the rules do seem to indicate that I'm wrong.

            1. Camp No No
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              I think they indicate you're pretty much doing it right.

              1. Pasqualinho
                • 16 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                It's the 'deliberate' thing that's confusing me. I think you can pretty much tell in some cases that it's not deliberate, but it is gaining an advantage. Like the Neymar incident today. For me, I wouldn't give a goal but the rules seem to say that if it's not deliberate, then the goal stands.

                1. Wilshere Knowledge
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  This is entirely my point.

                  I simply said that the rules should be redefined in some manner, suggesting that a foul should be given if a player is advantaged in some way.

            2. Ryan
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • Has Moderation Rights
              • 14 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              I'd say you are right and you are refereeing it in the spirit of the game. I'd hate to see referee's accused of making incorrect calls if its refereed as well as you've just outlined.

            3. Camp No No
              • 12 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              Although I think the handball for face protection, if hand is of any distance from the said face, should officially be a foul.

              1. Pasqualinho
                • 16 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Maybe. But you could argue that if you're protecting your face and your hands are some distance away then that's an unnatural position. I know when I'm protecting my face that they're pretty close.

                1. Camp No No
                  • 12 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  But say, if you pull your head a bit down and raise your arm in front of it, then you're actually covering space with your arm and it's a foul.

                  1. Pasqualinho
                    • 16 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    I would agree. Depends on how far the ball has travelled also - If you've time to see it, you've time to head it.

            4. the axolotl
              • 14 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              pretty much the way it should be.

              a ref gave a peno against me one time when i sliced a clearance into my own outstretched arm, and he said my arm was in an unnatural position. still raging ๐Ÿ™

              1. Camp No No
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                It was the right decision though.

              2. Camp No No
                • 12 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                Not that you were getting advantage of it, though, so I really feel for you in this case.

              3. Twisted Saltergater
                • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                • 16 Years
                10 years, 11 months ago

                That shouldn't have been a penalty. Nowhere in the FA rules does it say anything about "unnatural position". If the referee gave the reason that he thought your arm was assisting your clearance and therefore deliberately in the so called unnatural position, then it is a foul.

                1. Ryan
                  • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                  • Has Moderation Rights
                  • 14 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  It does but its worded in a different way

                  - the movement of the hand towards the ball (not the ball towards the hand)

                  1. Twisted Saltergater
                    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                    • 16 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    That's something else altogether. Clearing a ball and it hitting your arm or hand isn't the movement of the hand towards the ball.

                    There is always going to be interpretation with awarding a handball because it uses the word "deliberate"... that means it is no longer black and white.

                    We should accept a referee's interpretation of what was deliberate or not and move on. The alternative is saying every time the ball touches the hand or arm is handball and a foul... which is nonsensical.

                    1. Ryan
                      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                      • Has Moderation Rights
                      • 14 Years
                      10 years, 11 months ago

                      Yep I agree. Perhaps something about 'advantage given' should apply in this instance. Neymar was advantaged by his handball for instance.

                      1. Ryan
                        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                        • Has Moderation Rights
                        • 14 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        Not that thats in the rules but perhaps it should be?

                      2. Twisted Saltergater
                        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                        • 16 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        I think the referee is covered simply by stating he thought Neymar raised his arm "artificially high" such that he could disguise a handball should he miss the header. He's not in the wrong for saying that as the rules are asking all referees to interpret what a player intended.

                      3. Ryan
                        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                        • Has Moderation Rights
                        • 14 Years
                        10 years, 11 months ago

                        Yep, and I'd agree with that interpretation. Seems fair to me.

                2. the axolotl
                  • 14 Years
                  10 years, 11 months ago

                  exactly, the rule says deliberate hand ball. and this was the most obvious hand ball physically, but the most obviously unintentional handball.

                  1. Twisted Saltergater
                    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
                    • 16 Years
                    10 years, 11 months ago

                    Exactly. Your ref had been watching too many Sky pundits talk about why handballs have been given ๐Ÿ™‚

                    Very harsh.

        2. Camp No No
          • 12 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          The rules say nothing about intention, so how would it be the intention that matters. Most of the time, it is the movement of the arm that decides the case.

  25. In Like Flynn.
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 15 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    The major change needed in the European club competitions would be to axe the Champions League bail out into the Europa League.
    If they're out they're out.

    Any change you think would improve them?

    1. Epic Fail
      • 15 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      That's the first change I'd make. I can't see them doing it though, money spinner.

    2. Wilshere Knowledge
      • 12 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I'd prefer to see clubs from the same league unable to be drawn against each other as far as it is possible.

      We see these clubs play each other all the time, I think more of the same should be avoided.

  26. Zombie
    • 13 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Some of my mates who are Pool fans are saying - Chiellini payback ๐Ÿ˜ฏ ๐Ÿ˜ฏ

  27. the axolotl
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Barry Glendenning ‏@bglendenning 1m1 minute ago
    Yes, we're all shivering from withdrawal after a whole hour of post-season No Football, but Japan v Canada on now in Women's World Cup

    1. Ryan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      There is an U20 World cup on

      1. Ryan
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Supposedly the 2nd biggest international competition in the world behind the actual mens world cup

      2. the axolotl
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        rugby?

        1. Ryan
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 14 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Football U20 WC

          2nd biggest football tourny in the world

          1. Ryan
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • Has Moderation Rights
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            Games don't start for a few more hours yet though

          2. the axolotl
            • 14 Years
            10 years, 11 months ago

            didn't even know it was on. rugby under 20s on now too.

            1. Ryan
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • Has Moderation Rights
              • 14 Years
              10 years, 11 months ago

              And I didn't even know that was on. Lol, I guess if my country is hosting the U20 Football WC then I should know about that.

    2. Ginkapo FPL
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Its not Japan....

      1. the axolotl
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        yup, he's being reminded of that on twitter.
        no possible joke here ๐Ÿ˜‰

    3. Captain Shirokov
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      He means China.....right?

    4. the axolotl
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Barry Glendenning ‏@bglendenning 7m7 minutes ago
      I am going to discreetly delete that mega faux pas. *shhh everyone*

      Barry Glendenning ‏@bglendenning 6m6 minutes ago
      Yes, we're all shivering from withdrawal after a whole hour of post-season No Football, but CHINA v Canada on now in Women's World Cup

      Barry Glendenning retweeted
      @bglendenning @OzNonedy a great bunch of lads

      ๐Ÿ™‚

  28. Ginkapo FPL
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    bbc3 are showing womens Canada vs China now...

    1. Somalion
      • 16 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Watched some and it was, sadly, dire.

  29. The Light Knight
    • 14 Years
    10 years, 11 months ago

    Canada vs China just kicking off in Women's World Cup. Just took the anthems for my first sexist thought of tournament

    1. Ryan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      Its not even on TV here in NZ. Very disappointing ๐Ÿ™

      1. The Light Knight
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Thats a shame. The start has been Ok

    2. Dr Dream
      • 13 Years
      10 years, 11 months ago

      I don't know what to say without appearing sexist...but I'll try. I'm all for equality but I can't help but think that the viewing figures for this match will leave a mountain to climb for Women's football..

      Maybe the England matches on BBC1 might help more....

      1. Ryan
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Or having matches at all on TV ๐Ÿ˜•

      2. Ginkapo FPL
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        There IS a big mountain to climb for womens football. They already know that.

        1. Dr Dream
          • 13 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          BBC 3 is about as dark and dingy a corner as the BBC could find.

      3. Wilshere Knowledge
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        No sexism involved.

        If they actually want equality, then the sport should be sold on the quality. The standard is poor, so I won't watch it.

        It's a condescending attitude to say the quality is poor, but they're only girls after all.

      4. The Machine
        • 12 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        The "sexism" argument usually goes OTT. There are some basic differences between men and women you just cant ignore. Women's football will never really be popular no matter how hard anyone tries. You cant force people to like something that just isnt entertaining

      5. The Light Knight
        • 14 Years
        10 years, 11 months ago

        Being in Fifa 16 will be a great help

        1. Dr Dream
          • 13 Years
          10 years, 11 months ago

          Won't do any harm for sure.