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Collective Intelligence: Part 1

Managing by Committee

“We will delegate by discussion,” said Roy Evans confidently at the appointment of fellow Liverpool manager Gerard Houllier in July 1998. For the first time in their history Liverpool had joint managers.

However the experiment was short lived, with Evans departing before the year was out. At his final press conference Evans claimed he didn’t want to be a “ghost on the wall” haunting the now sole manager of Liverpool, Houllier.

Houllier later explained: “The players like to be able to refer to one manager. The concept [of joint managers] was obviously extremely difficult for them.”

Thankfully in FPL we don’t have to manage the precious egos of highly paid sportsmen each week. We aren’t faced with having to explain to Paul Pogba why he’s not in our team even though his price is a relatively modest £8.1m, or tell Mo Salah we are having blasphemous thoughts of selling him because we are worried he doesn’t offer value.

So perhaps the concept of joint management could work better in the fantasy version of football?

This article is about what happened when a group of FPL managers from the Fantasy Football Scout community decided to run a single team. By combining their FPL knowledge and wisdom into one, would they be a success or would they just end up arguing over who to bench and ultimately fall out?

To answer that question let’s start with a look at another experimental FPL team.

Collective Intelligence vs Artificial Intelligence

Featured on the BBC in May, Squadguru is the Artificial Intelligence (AI) algorithm created by Dr Gopal Ramchurn and Dr Tim Matthews from the University of Southampton. Using “Bayesian Machine Learning techniques and a combinatorial optimisation algorithm to optimise team selection”, last season Squadguru finished with 2,270 points and was placed 30,929 out of 5,910,135 players.

This sounds impressive but how did the AI team fare against the joint-managed or Collective Intelligence (CI) team run by members of the Fantasy Football Scout community?

In a word, badly.

The CI team finished a mightily impressive 345th overall with 2,410 points.

Humans 1 – Bayesian Machine Learning 0.

It’s always satisfying to beat the Germans. (And even teams that only sound German.)

Not only did the CI team soundly beat the AI team by 140 points but, out of the 32 managers who formed part of the management collective, 23 also beat the AI with their individual sides.

So who are this talented (and handsome) bunch of Fantasy Football addicts?

Introducing ‘The Cønts’

All members of Fantasy Football Scout, we (yes, I am one of them) include FPL managers from 14 different countries ranging from such diverse places as Bermuda and Serbia to Pakistan and India, France, Sweden and Norway.  There’s a Pole and a Bulgarian, a Belgian and a Canadian, not forgetting the odd Brit, Irishman, and American too.

We range in age from 18 to 56, and amongst our number we count A-level students and CEOs, teachers and psychologists, entrepreneurs and DJs. Even a former professional footballer and the Community Manager at FFS. All united by our love for FPL.

Formed by AbuBakar Siddiq (aka TheFantasyFreak) two seasons ago, this motley crew includes a fair dose of FPL pedigree. AbuBakar himself finished a remarkable 4th overall in the 2014/15 season and three more members have also recorded ranks in the top 100 – Utkarsh Dalmia (aka Zophar), Geoff Dance (aka Geoff), and LateRiser12.

Last season’s best placed manager Matt Kearney (aka Bowstring the Carp) narrowly missed out on a two digit finish, ending the campaign in 126th place (blame the Scoutcast curse!). Matt was the only member of the group to finish higher than the Cønts team – our name for the joint-managed side.

Why the name ‘Cønts’? It simply encapsulates what a lovely bunch of people we are and the admiration we hold for an ex Chelsea manager. Although I’m not quite sure about the significance of the Scandinavian letter ø, I have to admit.

Inevitably, this being 2018, we all communicate via WhatsApp. Mixed in with the banter we use WhatsApp to discuss our teams and the latest football news.

How Did The Cønts Team Come About?

“The original idea to manage one FPL team was born in the 2016/17 campaign”, explains United fan Jan Sienkiewicz (aka JØ), the main driving force behind the Cønts team. “One of our members had health issues and, not having the time to manage his own team, he decided to leave his ‘dead’ team for us to manage.”

Mercifully our comrade is alive and well, only his FPL team suffered temporary ‘death’. JØ continues:

“We made the decisions for his team for the rest of the season with brilliant results, even though most of the transfers were usually last-minute. At the end of the campaign, I came up with the idea of setting up a separate team – we wanted to check whether [our success] was a one-off scenario.”

How Did We Do So Well?

One of the key differences between the joint-managed Cønts team compared to our individual teams is that we don’t particularly care about the Cønts team. It’s often an afterthought.

Our individual teams matter to us – we can agonise over decisions, worry about prices rises, and have been known to get upset when we have a bad gameweek.

We are passionate about FPL. We invest a lot of time in it – in addition to web forums a number of the group are active on social media, a few like Johannes Nessa (aka Niemi) and myself contribute community articles to FFS, Jake Conyard (aka Lawro) helped organise last year’s Community Watch Tournament, Jonathan Kahn (aka JK) writes for It’s Round and White, Matt runs his own blog, Zophar writes articles for Fantasy Football Fix, and John Lambert (aka Jossy) has created an FPL planner for Fantasy Football Hub.

We aim to be good FPL managers. In David Wardale’s excellent book ‘Wasting Your Wildcard’ Peter Blake (not a Cønt) describes good FPL managers as ‘the ones that intake a lot of data from multiple sources, which can include watching players on the pitch, listening to managers in press conferences, utilising communities’ collective knowledge (the “wisdom of the crowds” approach) and statistical analysis.’

The Cønts team is the beneficiary of this research. Before each deadline we distil our collective wisdom into making decisions for the team. We normally draw up a shortlist of suggested transfers and vote for our preferred moves.

What’s also crucial is that we don’t overthink our transfers. We want the Cønts team to reflect the group and so we invariably make the most popular or template move the group has made that week. We end up with fairly safe obvious picks.

The Benefits of Collective Decision Making

The fact we don’t particularly care about the Cønts team is important. It means we don’t worry about price rises or team value, we don’t get upset when our new signing blanks or when our captain doesn’t deliver.

Don’t get me wrong – we aren’t going to take loads of hits simply because the Cønts team doesn’t matter. We want to do as well as we can but our hearts will never rule our heads.

This knowledgeable yet dispassionate approach means we sidestep a number of traits that can hamper decision-making.

For instance, hardwired into us not only as humans but as primates is a fear of losing. We hate losing. It’s been proven that we feel losses twice as much as we feel gains (Kahneman & Tversky) and this can push us to make bad decisions.

In FPL it doesn’t get much worse than missing out on a player when he hauls. Even famously patient FPL managers like Ville Rönkä have been known to succumb to impulsive rage transfers simply to ease the pain of lost points.

This will never happen with the Cønts team because it is not run by an individual. The group never makes an early transfer, let alone a rage transfer.

In his TED talk Dan Gilbert highlights a number of reasons why individuals make bad decisions. He shows that we are enormously impatient. According to Dan Gilbert, people will always chose to have $50 now rather than wait a month and have $60.

We all agree that ‘more is better than less’ and ‘now is better than later’, but we find it hard when these two rules conflict. In FPL, having patience in a player is sometimes the better move. And it is much easier to show patience when you are less emotionally affected by the outcomes, as with the joint managed Cønts team.

Another error individuals tend to make is to compare the value of an item to the past. As all good salesmen know people love a discount. When a holiday to Hawaii is offered for $1,600 instead of $2,000 most people will agree that it’s a good deal.

However when the same holiday is offered for $700 we would be disappointed to find that it had gone up to $1,500 by the time we pay for it. As Gilbert points out: “a good deal that used to be a great deal, is not nearly as good as an awful deal that was once a horrible deal”.

In FPL this can affect our perception of a player – either one that has risen substantially in price, or one that has changed position from the previous season. Last year Crystal Palace’s Wilfried Zaha and West Ham’s Marko Arnautovic were both great deals as midfielders, can we expect the same amount of points now they are classified as forwards?

In both cases – a price increase or a position change – simply because a player isn’t a great deal now doesn’t mean he isn’t good value.

It can be a combination of these biases – loss aversion, impatience, errors in comparison – that help explain behaviour like bandwagons or buying players early so we don’t miss out on price rises. While these are not necessarily bad moves they are not always the best moves either.

As Matt pointed out when interviewed last year: “It’s all risk calculation and you need a clear head to do that.” The Cønts team, because it is a dispassionate collective effort, has that clear head.

Analysing the Season

As you can see from the graph below the Cønts team didn’t have the best start last season, and experienced some fairly erratic gameweek ranks.

The vertical scale is from rank 1 to 4.5m. The distance between the ranks corresponds to the number of points separating them. For instance there are 299pts between rank 1 and rank 100k and 191pts between 100k and 1m. The graph gives an idea of how difficult it is to move up the ranks as you near the summit.

I’ve added markers to show when we played our chips; Wildcards in Gameweeks 12 and 33 (red), Bench Boost in Gameweek 34 (blue), Free Hit in Gameweek 35 (yellow), Triple Captain in Gameweek 37 (black).

In the second part of this article I will analyse our successful season in detail. Discover how we moved from outside the top one million in Gameweek 8 to finish narrowly outside the top 100 by Gameweek 38.

TopMarx Fan of Fantasy Football and Monty Python. "Archimedes out to Socrates, Socrates back to Archimedes, Archimedes out to Heraclitus, he beats Hegel. Heraclitus a little flick, here he comes on the far post, Socrates is there, Socrates heads it in! Socrates has scored! The Greeks are going mad, the Greeks are going mad! Socrates scores, got a beautiful cross from Archimedes. The Germans are disputing it. Hegel is arguing that the reality is merely an a priori adjunct of non-naturalistic ethics, Kant via the categorical imperative is holding that ontologically it exists only in the imagination, and Marx is claiming it was offside. Follow them on Twitter

104 Comments Post a Comment
  1. How do you overcome biases?
    TopMarx
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 11 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    Thank you for editing Geoff!

    I think it's fascinating how the Cønts team beat all except one of our individual teams! Individually we didn't manage to completely overcome our biases. I'd be interested to hear what others think about this:

    Which biases do you fall into? Do you find yourself tapping into the collective community and not making your own decisions? How do you deal with 'bandwagons'? Do you find the template useful? Do you have biases towards certain players that affect your decisions? Loss aversion, impatience, errors in comparison? Price rises?

    Loss aversion is a big one for me, I hate missing out on points! I'm trying to be more patient this season, not making early transfers or getting caught up in bandwagons.

    1. Pacer.
      • 9 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Really interesting project and article.

      Lots of stuff individual managers can take from this. It's reassuring that it seems to reflect a lot of the changes in how I've approached FPL this year. Don't be impulsive, be patient except in exceptional circumstances, make a list of options and try to do what's best for the team overall.

    2. Limited & Mediocre Mana…
      • 8 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Which biases do you fall into?
      - Without trying to blow my own trumpet, I think I'm much better than the average FPL manager at being unbiased. I'm a bit of a special case because I didn't come to FPL through a love of football, but rather fell in love with FPL and as a consequence now follow football much closer. I have no strong affinity with any team and I didn't have preconceived notions of how football worked.

      Do you find yourself tapping into the collective community and not making your own decisions?
      - I don't think so. I don't post RMTs or questions about my own team (except in very rare cases) because doing this takes away opportunity to look at your reasons behind making a decision. Also, if you don't know another person's thought process behind their answer, it's pretty meaningless in my opinion.

      How do you deal with bandwagons?
      - This is a very broad question. In short, I look if I think they're actually a decent option compared with other areas in my squad. It's unlikely I'll get them unless I genuinely think I'm missing out by not jumping in now. Sometimes a bandwagon might simply be the optimum transfer. You don't always have to be fancy.

      Do you find the template useful?
      - I don't really use this word. I think it's totally meaningless and have never seen it used in a helpful context.

      Do you have biases towards certain players that affect your decisions?
      - Alexis Sanchez. The first year I played FPL was the first year of the chips. I used the TC on Sanchez's 25, then in 16/17 I used the TC on Sanchez's 14. I decided to use the TC on Sanchez again last season, despite nothing pointing to him being a good option (stats in the toilet at MUN etc). He got me 2*3 = 6. This was purely a biased pick, and while he was worth more than 2 points, it was good to get this reality check.
      - Andrew Robertson. I don't know why, but I love this guy. I owned him for the latter half of last season while everyone was saying how average LIV defence were. I think this "bias" shouldn't affect FPL because right now, he's a standout option.

      Loss aversion, impatience, errors in comparison?
      - No loss aversion. Trust in the maths and the numbers and it's all fine. It's why I went without Harry Kane in GW8. Not because I didn't think he was a great option, but because it simply wasn't worth it for my team. I owned Aguero from the start and got Hazard in ahead of his hatty. You have to give yourself the opportunity to get these players in ahead of their hauls, not after.
      - I'm a pretty patient guy and have put myself in a position to save FT (assuming Salah is fit). It becomes easier once you've practised patience successfully in the past. If you always give in to the temptation to take the hit, for example, it will become harder to avoid doing the same thing in the future.
      - I play prices pretty aggressively once I've decided on a transfer, however, it's pretty much always a secondary thought. I took a -0.4 drop on Jota for example, simply because I chose to keep him in GW3 and didn't then have a good opportunity to sell. It didn't really do any harm, it was just unfortunate.

      1. Pacer.
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        You're absolutely right about patience being something that requires practice. You have to rewire your brain to ignore impulse and to accept gains and losses over a slightly longer time frame.

        I guess the key is managing this whilst still being able to weed out the very exceptional circumstances when speed of action IS required

        1. Limited & Mediocre Mana…
          • 8 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Yeah, it's all well and good managers saying "you need to be patient", and I agree that IN GENERAL the average FPL manager could do with being a bit more patient. But sometimes you simply have to accept that maybe you made a bad decision to bring someone in, or were too slow to bring someone in (like those without Hazard, for example). Getting that balance right is very difficult, everything has to be looked at as an individual situation and the pros and cons thoroughly analysed.

      2. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        You make some really good points - "Sometimes a bandwagon might simply be the optimum transfer", completely agree, just because there's a bandwagon it doesn't mean that the player is a good or bad move, sometimes it is the best transfer.

        I agree I think RMTs are really hard. Giving advice and receiving advice, it helps to know what type of manager you are, and who is giving the advice. For instance a patient manager might buy a player and keep him over a period of poor fixtures because he knows he will deliver long term. This could apply to players of high price or low price, like Salah or Ings. Whereas another more aggressive or bolder manager might play the game differently and get rid of them. Ultimately it's a marathon not a race and both approaches can work.

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          *not a sprint! a marathon is a race doh!

          1. Jøssy ⭐
            • 9 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

    3. Pacer.
      • 9 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I've had to contend with a big heap of loss aversion the last fortnight. I decided to go no-salah (even before the flag) for the next 3 weeks. In a sense it's even worse to know the points for him are likely coming than to have missed them and be acting retrospectively. But I'm convinced that in the wider picture it's not the optimal route through these 3 weeks for my team. But you feel aversion so strongly when you can identify a single player point source so much more clearly than smaller, collective, multi-player, structural and transfer gains that play out potentially over a longer period. FIGHT THE AVERSION!

    4. Jøssy ⭐
      • 9 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Loss aversion is huge for me, and it's the desire to have the current "hot property" that often leads me to take excessive hits.... and consequently to build great TV.

      I could certainly do with reigning that in, because I know most great managers are far more patient in their approach.

      1. Pacer.
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        I see you have had 3 very good gameweeks and climbed significantly. What has been the effect of the hits you've made there. Do you think you've climbed because of that or despite that?

        1. Jøssy ⭐
          • 9 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Well... you will note that the 3 week run coincided with me playing my WC, which has resulted in a fantastic upturn for my team, after a very solid start to the season anyway (keeping within 279k since GW1)... I've taken one hit since then, which was a big error in my opinion, and was forced by an early week decision that I felt I needed to jump on Hart. Would have paid off if he'd got the expected CS against HUD.

          That said, the majority of my hits pre-WC have paid off for me... particular my GW2 hit tow swap our Firmino for Mane, as I just identified that he looked far more threatening.

          In general, I have taken hits to jump on bandwagons early, and that's meant that my current Team Value is 105m. I'm sure my early hits helped me to maximise my spend when I came to building my WC squad.

      2. scubasmithy
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        I am exactly the same jossy, it's hard to resist

    5. Pacer.
      • 9 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I think one of my biases in the past is towards big name players. And I see that bias playing regularly in teams people post, i.e the desire to own or assumption that the optimal team is one where as few a big name are omitted as possible. I've seen many teams posted recently with 4 big hitters including Salah and honesty they look a disaster. Perhaps they will prove me wrong and I will end up having to re-examine my new bias towards structure and efficiency

      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Well this is the thing - I wonder if this season will be different?

        Looking at the top FPL teams last year definitely it was a case of one or two premium players and a good squad balance. But this year we have players like Doherty and WB who enable us to spend more money elsewhere. Players like Jimenez and Ings too. A four at the back formation is totally viable, a premium defender is the same cost as a mid priced midfielder or forward.

        I think this year there are more value options available, although I agree we are still right to question the value of premium players like Salah.

        1. Pacer.
          • 9 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I definitely agree it has shifted to 3 premium players looking optimal

    6. XabiAlonso
      • 8 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I'm a sucker for Liverpool players. It's a bit of a weakness, it didn't even work well for me when we had a decent season last year or came 2nd a few seasons ago

      1. FPL_Crisis
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        This made me laugh (fellow Liverpool fan here)

      2. Jøssy ⭐
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        The year we came second is my greatest ever FPL season!!

        However, I'm quite good at dumping our players if I don't think they're offering value.

        (I certainly didn't that year)

        https://imgur.com/a/USRfFWn

    7. The Rumour Mill
      • 7 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I'm probably TOO patient at times. Stuck with Ibrahimovic as he broke Joe's goals imminent table into thousands of pieces. Same thing happenned to me with Firmino last season as referenced by Numb on his Meet the manager video. Been patient with Mane this season after a good start and consequently was late to the Hazard party.

      Its not really a bias but timing of moves is somthing I struggle with at times.

      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Definitely timing is crucial. But ultimately managers play differently - bold vs patient approach, both can work.

        What happened to you last season with Firmino? Ultimately Numb's extreme patience was rewarded, did that happen to you?

        1. The Rumour Mill
          • 7 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I got Firmino in about GW3 or 4 last season, missed his early season points and had him for a run of blanks apart from a header against huddersfield in about Gw8. Got rid eventually, but then was quite quick to bring him back in around xmas when he started performing again and held him from then until the second wildcard in about Gw32 or so.

          So I probabaly missed a few points from him, but also missed some of his blanks.

          Currently on WC so trying to set up a long term squad which should hopefully be quite robust and reward patience! 😉

    8. Darth_Krid
      • 6 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I would describe myself as extremely loss-averse too. I'm happy to make the obvious transfer, hop on bandwagons to build team value, play the ownership game and generally play it safe with regards to captains etc.

      Many would say it's an extremely boring way to play, and I won't deny it. A dullard is kinda what it says on the tin! But it has brought me success, and for me, the joys of a strong OR and winning a ML at the end of the season outweighs the week-to-week boredom. It's no coincidence that my worst season (last year) came from me trying to play a bit more maverick and have fun with a few cheeky captain punts and transfers. While it might have brought a few more 'highs' on the odd weekend than a normal season, the low at the end made me decide I'd never do it again.

      As for biases, I strongly believe that being a neutral makes this game much easier. As a United fan, I weirdly don't like owning their players and the inbuilt pessimism about your own club has made me choose not to captain our players (Lukaku or Ibra in years gone by). But I also won't captain anyone against them (so Hazard this weekend for example). In a cruel twist of fate, it's kind of lucky that we've not challenged for the title for years because it means I've owned City, Liverpool etc. players guilt-free and not minded when they get hauls.

      If the title race was incredibly close, I have no idea how I'd play FPL because I'd hate owning any rivals' players or wanting them to do well.

      As for patience, I like building up strong value in the first half of the season and would happily take a few hits and make early transfers to gain 0.3 or 0.4. I find it pays off in the second half of the season where my transfers come much closer to the deadline and my patience threshold is much higher. In my eyes, the points difference between a 9-10m mid and a 6-7m one come the second WC is worth the points hits earlier in the season.

      1. Gentlemen Crier
        • 10 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        I feel exactly the way you do in those first 2 paras. Personally, it feels like cramming in as many highly owned players into the template structure is an exciting challenge in itself. Dullards unite!

    9. Daft Bob
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 6 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I have a problem with overthinking my moves. I'm actually very natural at picking the right players with minimal effort using the eye test but I've found that doing loads of research makes me way more hesitant about my picks and complicates matters. It's not that I spend vast amounts of time researching, it's just that I lose touch of what my gut instinct is by the time I make a transfer, and my gut is usually right.

      I'm new to FPL and still learning, so it won't be hard to change, I think! I guess the main thing bringing me back here is the fact I could miss crucial info that everyone here takes advantage of. I think that the leads I visit forums like this the better I'll perform. Not to say these sites don't benefit others more than it helps me, of course.

      1. Daft Bob
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 6 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        *the less i visit forums like these

      2. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Stats can be misleading, they can also be very useful. It depends what we are talking about but in general I'm less guided by stats than I was a few years ago but I still find them useful for building a watchlist of players.

        1. Daft Bob
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 6 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I find high level stats useful for checking if there any great picks I wouldn't have considered otherwise and for making 50/50 decisions. The level of detail needed to make the most of stats, however, is too time consuming for me, but I can see why the players that do (and have the analytical skills to do it well) get such good ranks.

    10. Desperately Seeking Dusan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 12 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Really interesting post. That you're loss averse makes you human - all studies show that the vast majority, outside of FPL of course, are more afraid of loss than they are keen to make gains and even avoid bets that they should, in fact, take in favor of one where the loss is guaranteed to be smaller.

      Because I'm aware of a lot of these things (I recommend 'Thinking Fast & Slow by Daniel Kahneman for an easy read on a whole bunch of biases), I think I'm less prone to them (I would think that - that's a bias in itself and I'm probably subject to loads without realizing which is even worse) and since I do a job that hones you to avoid such things. But just perusing the comments on this site, I often see the following:

      1) Herd mentality. It's shown over and over in studies that if somebody sees others around them publicly giving a wrong answer to a question, they will also give what is clearly a wrong answer. If enough people on here say somebody is essential, there are a lot who all jump on without questioning... and you see it in the complaining afterwards when said player fails.

      2) Fear Of Missing Out. Kane last week was a prime example. If you could get him in for free or were on a WC, it *was* a logical choice to have him. But such was the hype and panic that he was going to get some ridiculous number of goals, I could see 4 and 8 point hits going on to get him in for one week.

      3) Recency bias. People weight the near past much more (which you should, like an exponential average) but to a real fault sometimes. If a player gets a haul, say Fraser, of 18 points, there's a frenzy to get him in, a 5.6M player, then huge disappointment when he doesn't replicate that huge week in the following game, despite his record and price suggesting that the haul was really a one-off.

      4) Confirmation bias. I see people grab at any piece of data or news to justify a team selection they have already made (and I probably AM guilty of this with Salah) and to justify their teams rather than accepting alternative evidence that suggests they've made the wrong selection.

      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        I find this all really interesting, as Dan Gilbert pointed out, we think ‘more is better than less’ and ‘now is better than later’ but struggle when these two rules conflict. Not thinking about FPL for a moment, these biases are fascinating, why have they evolved? They must have served us well in the past. If you are willing to divulge, I'm curious about what job you do?

    11. JÆKS ⭐
      • 9 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Great read! Seems like a bunch of weirdos though in that Conts group...

      1. Niemi
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        You would probably leave the group if you were a part of it 😉

    12. WesMantooth
      • 13 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      First of all a really cool story and good article. Must be a lot of fun to be a part of this experiment. But its also disheartening to know that someone out there lost the "braggingrights"/achievement of having a three-digit rank at the end of the season, due to the fact that a group of players were'nt following the rules with regards to multiple accounts.

      As for the HT, i sometimes find myself biased towards the players "breaking out". Not sure what to even call this bias, but its a mistake i've made a couple of times. I'll give some examples. Ramsey and YaYa a few seasons back. Their points, goalscoring and general level of exceptional attacking play, was just to big of a mismatch with my prior conceptions of their abilities as footballers and FPL-assets. This lead me to believe that their displays were to good to be true. Its also happened in lesser degrees with several other players, but those two will be permanently burned in my memory.

      Somewhat similar to the last one, is the idea of being "too late to the party". Sterling had a sort of "breakthrough" last season, and although I was probably Quicker to accept the fact that he was coming good, I still didnt manage to see it fit to Get him in before gw37. Again, im not sure what to call this bias, but as soon as a player has large ownership and risen a lot from the pricepoint where most good managers bought him, I become less inclined to buy him. The logic is somewhat sound: buying him at a vastly more expensive pricepoint sets me at a disadvantage against others. But at the same time, not owning him could hurt so much if he still offera tremendous value at his new pricepoint. This year i fear that not owning Fraser is going to end up being a similar mistake.

      I find the "template" useful to give me a map of who to cheer for every week, but I rarely let it dictate my moves.

      Im usually more susceptible to bandwagons in the early stages of the season, as TV is of some interest at that stage.

      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Yes, I hear what you are saying about the multiple accounts rule, it does make me feel uneasy.

        The 'too late to the party' bias might be similar to making 'errors in comparison' that I mention in the article? I think you would enjoy the Dan Gilbert talk, linked to in the article. There's much more in the talk than I mention in the article.

    13. HNI
      • 11 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Main bias I have for is only Salah. All top managers have him so I am keeping too. He gets his chanes as Member tools show but he and liv are missing something season I cannot really pinpoint. And no its not Karius. Its mostly have to do with drive. I somehow managed to avoid Kane love by the top managers thanks to my past experience of knee jerking Kane in screwing my last season royally.

  2. balint84
    • 7 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    recommended 4.5 defender?

    Duffy, Yedlin or Zanka?

    (I have Wolves, CP, Boro defender also)

  3. Limited & Mediocre Mana…
    • 8 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    Very nice read. It makes me even happier that I finished on 2420 points 😉

    1. TopMarx
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 11 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      haha what's your secret?

      1. Limited & Mediocre Mana…
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        If I had to best summarise my approach: Think deeply about how the game fundamentally works, always question what you think you know, always analyse the decision AT THE TIME IT WAS MADE and not through the lense of hindsight/short term outcomes.

        Obviously being on the right side of variance helps too! Can't really say if that was the case last season or not though.

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          "always analyse the decision AT THE TIME IT WAS MADE and not through the lense of hindsight/short term outcomes"

          Absolutely, just because a move doesn't pay off it doesn't mean it was a bad move.

        2. G-Whizz
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 6 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          "AT THE TIME IT WAS MADE"
          Couldn't agree more...

    2. Ebnul3ee
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 8 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      I finished last season with 2471 points and ranked 18 overall.
      What helped me is proper planning, I planned on gameweek 25 how my team will be in gameweek 31, and I will play my WC on GW 32, as I will have 2 transfers on Gameweek 34, and my plan is to play bench boost on that week, FH on 35, Triple Cap on 37, all my plan worked well except the triple cap on Kane, he scored only 10 🙁
      Another important thing is I took hit only 2/3 times and in most gameweeks made the transfer on Friday/Saturday after having updates from press conferences.
      I always keep 1/2/3 differential pick, and keep my Captain as the most consistent one or most valuable, if I had to take risk on my captain I always went for it on Kane, Sterling, Salah, Jesus/Lukaku(at the time of beginning) in most cases. I captained Kane on his 16,17,17 points though got several 1/2 from him, also Salah for consistent point. I never had Aguero which was a bad decision.

      What I learn?
      Patience is the key and when you keep your faith on a player who has good stat but maybe not working for some bad luck. They always returened me points, I can say the examples of Shaqiri, Stanislas, Arnautovic, Aanholt, Zaha, Gross all returned points though maybe gave blank in first few weeks...

      Watching most of the games also improve your chance of doing better in FPL.

      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Congratulations on a great rank last season!

        In terms of deciding when to show patience with a player are there particular stats you prioritise or does it depend on the player? (aside from obviously looking at different stats for a defender and a forward!)

  4. Hooky
    • 9 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    Very interesting. Do you always make your transfer the day before the deadline? Doing a wildcard with that many people involved must be fun!

    1. Jøssy ⭐
      • 9 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Yes, we do. Sometimes to my frustration, as I see some targets rise in price or become unaffordable... but that's my own bias.

      When we WC we tend to take the "safe" approach... so we'll be picking a fairly template team, usually including all of those players who are most prevalent in the community's own teams. Generally, our approach is to be quite "boring" with our team selections, and it seems to have worked quite well.

      1. Hooky
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Thanks, I guess sometimes it could be frustrating if there is a very obvious transfer and there is a 0.2 or 0.3 swing during the week but its obviously working quite well doing it the way you are!

    2. JK - Cønt ⭐
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 12 Years
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Yes, sometimes we even make it on the day itself. We really treat it quite casually. We never know if we have been priced out a move because we never consider it until the Friday so we just work with what we have.. This means we often have players long after most serious players have jumped off. For example this season it currently still has Josh King and Bernardo Silva

      1. Hooky
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        That's worked out quite well keeping both of those players so far! Patience is definitely one of the key attributes to a consistent high rank and your method is definitely proving that so far.

      2. Back on the horse
        • 13 Years
        5 years, 5 months ago

        It's easy to see why you still have Bilva: https://twitter.com/benmendy23/status/1053683479739805698

  5. Lawrø
    • 12 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    Bravo!

    An even better read the second time 😉

  6. Jøssy ⭐
    • 9 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    Lovely work Top Marx!! It's great being part of the team

  7. JasonG123
    • 10 Years
    5 years, 6 months ago

    What to do about Salah if on WC?

  8. MTPockets
      5 years, 6 months ago

      Interesting. For info some research is questioning whether evidence supports the generalised idea of loss aversion. Artile title is a little click-baity but: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/why-the-most-important-idea-in-behavioral-decision-making-is-a-fallacy/

      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Good article, thank you for linking. I agree that loss aversion is not always 100% understood and is sometimes applied in situations that have little to do with loss aversion. However one of the links I included in the article shows that loss aversion has been demonstrated in capuchin monkeys, I think it's a really deep rooted bias we have. For that experiment they taught the monkeys to use a currency, the first non human currency! It's a pretty clever experiment.

        But I will definitely read more about the idea of loss aversion being a fallacy, I find it an interesting subject.

        1. MTPockets
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Will watch the talk later cheers. I'm not in a position to dispute it, just also interested. Agree there's often a mix-up of ideas - e.g. loss aversion vs rational fear of irrecoverable loss, or rational avoidance of complexity in assessing odds of sequential life bets.

      2. diesel001
        • 7 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Impressive going from OR 1m in GW8 ish to OR 1k by GW 22ish. A lesson for all those managers that may have got off to a bad start.

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Exactly, it's been really interesting analysing the season. Rather than being consistent, the team had two good bursts of form when it jumped up the rankings. One from GW9 and another from GW18. I will reveal more in part two next week, and there's a surprise in store.

      3. meerlight
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 12 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Ah those were the days. Tøp stuff. Wasn't it FFF that came up with the ø? I'm sure Jøssy's got the transcript 🙄

        1. Jøssy ⭐
          • 9 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I do have the transcript indeed!! Haha 🙂

        2. BigManBakar
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          It was Froggy indeed!

      4. Pirlø's Pen
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        The Cønts!

        1. meerlight
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 12 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I'm missing you guys. It's just the time..

          1. Pirlø's Pen
            • 8 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Welcome back whenever.

          2. AK ⭐
            • 11 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Hi ML! Hope you're doing well. Goes without saying you'll always be a Cønts. Come back soon!

            1. AK ⭐
              • 11 Years
              5 years, 6 months ago

              Cønt*

      5. Darth_Krid
        • 6 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        This was an incredibly interesting read. Lawro told me about this team a little bit, but it's fascinating to see it put in context of the theory.

        Excited to read Part 2.

        1. BigManBakar
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          You'll be part of our lot in no time DK, you'll love the lads 🙂

          1. Darth_Krid
            • 6 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Haha thanks mate, I hope so!

      6. BigManBakar
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Brilliant read. Great stuff, Pukka and TopMarx and cheers for the mention! 🙂

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Thanks Boss 🙂

      7. TheHungryMøn ⭐
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Great article TopMarx!

        Lovely to be part of the Conts team, also looking forward to the second part, especially the part where the team made no transfers for 6GWs in a row 🙂

        1. Lawrø
          • 12 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Spoilers!

          1. AK ⭐
            • 11 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Don't leave the group this time, Lawro. 😆

            1. JÆKS ⭐
              • 9 Years
              5 years, 6 months ago

              Hahaha

              1. Jøssy ⭐
                • 9 Years
                5 years, 6 months ago

                There he is!!!

            2. BigManBakar
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • 11 Years
              5 years, 6 months ago

              😀 😀 😀

      8. SOTHPAW
        • 5 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Who you would you bench this week Trippier or Arnautovic? Or play both?

        1. Jøssy ⭐
          • 9 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I wouldn’t like to bench either! Who are your alternatives?

      9. Greyhead
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 5 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Great article and absolutely fascinating. Look forward to part 2.

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Thanks Greyhead, yes it should make interesting reading 🙂

      10. AK ⭐
        • 11 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Great article as always, TopMarx! Part 2 is going to be funny. 😀

      11. Je suis le chat
        • 10 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Fascinating stuff. What's the FPL id for the Conts team?

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          https://fantasy.premierleague.com/a/entry/12768/history not having a great season so far, but well set-up for the next run of fixtures, hopefully some green arrows soon

          1. Je suis le chat
            • 10 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Thanks. Good team though baffled it hasn't got Hazard.

      12. TheLoneRaver
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Excellent article, really enjoyable read. Cheers

      13. Numb
        • 9 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Very interesting article.

        I must admit, though, I am not really a fan of “extra teams” being created, be that algorithm or human control. I feel that this phenomenon is increasing and for every one of these teams in the top 1k or top 10k or whatever, that means one less real person with their real team who can get that satisfaction.

        1. Gnu
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 14 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          *coughs politely while going through my Buggu's*
          😉

        2. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I agree and I was/am worried about this. I'm not a fan of multiple teams, as the rules state "In the interest of fair play each person may only enter one team." I do feel slightly uncomfortable about the Cønts team doing so well and costing someone a place in the top 1k, 10k, or 100k.

          I mean I think there is a place for teams like this and the AI team, ideally they would exist outside the official standings. It would be great if there was a choice like that on FPL, then people who wanted to enter multiple teams as well could so without affecting a person's rank. I imagine such a system being exactly the same as normal FPL but instead of an official rank you get a 'this is where you would rank' rank. If that makes sense. So at the end of the season we can say the Cønts team would have come 345th, and that goes into the season history, but without it actually affecting the main game.

          This team evolved because we looked after the FPL team of someone who was not able to play. I think that's totally fine, in fact I think that's a nice thing to do. Although I appreciate the Cønts team is now an experiment that exists separately.

          In general I think with more people playing the game, it's good that ranking systems like the HoF look at the points difference from the maximum, rather than rank, when comparing seasons. However rank is important for managers, even though it gets harder and harder to achieve a top 10,000 rank each season. I mean I know you finished narrowly outside the top 10k last season, go back only a couple of seasons and I think your points score would have been good enough for a top 10k finish. Largely because there were fewer people playing the game.

          This is definitely a discussion worth having, I'm not sure what the answer is.

      14. Mysterion
        • 6 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Great stuff, loved the monkeynomics... are you guys running the team this season too?

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          Yes we are https://fantasy.premierleague.com/a/entry/12768/history currently the AI team is ahead of us!

          1. Patch
            • 6 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            Im guessing you will switch Cairney out right

            Basically a Jota 2.0

            1. TopMarx
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • Has Moderation Rights
              • 11 Years
              5 years, 6 months ago

              On a wildcard yes, I'm not sure we will make that move yet, concentrate on the starting 11.

      15. Mysterion
        • 6 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        https://fantasy.premierleague.com/a/team/3096318/event/8

        Seems like the combinatorial optimisation algorithm went rogue this week!

      16. ZaZaZu
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Does anyone have the problem of needing to make early transfers just to give you peace of mind your team is ready??

      17. Woodfoot
        • 5 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Could that Scandinavian ø in Cønts be a reference to the mathematical sign for average? As in averaging that wisdom, not average performance 😉

        Ps: don't know if anyone else made that joke already, didn't read all the comments...

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I like that!

          Slight tangent here but in the Ali vs Foreman boxing match (the Rumble in the Jungle) before round 8, the woman holding up the round number to let the audience know which round is next, held the number card sideways. Meaning it looked like an infinity symbol ∞ instead of an 8. I quite like that the most famous round of boxing ever took place in round 8.

      18. Patch
        • 6 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        What is the FPL ID for the current Conts team?

        You guys should form a shadow group to run BrexIn

          1. FPL Clem Fandango
            • 7 Years
            5 years, 6 months ago

            There are 10 better players in Anguilla? 🙂 🙂

      19. Chidi LaLa
        • 8 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Interesting. The 'Meet the Manager' videos and now, this article show just how important it is to be patient in the game. The dullard in me is growing really quickly.

      20. Bøwstring The Carp
        • 12 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        Fantastic stuff TopMarx!

        Honoured to be a part of this group; the Travelling Wilburys of the FPL world 😉

        Looking forward to Pt.2

        1. TopMarx
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 11 Years
          5 years, 6 months ago

          I'd better handle part 2 with care...

      21. DjNiuton
        • 12 Years
        5 years, 6 months ago

        hmmm. Very bracing article - I'm just outside 1 Million's position in ranking, so keeping the faith, that I can still finish within top 1k 🙂
        Cannot wait to read part 2!