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Members January 17

The Big Numbers – Gameweek 21

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Our usual post-Gameweek members article arrives this evening, as we cast an analytical eye over some of the standout performers over Saturday and Sunday’s ten fixtures.

Spurs’ red-hot frontman chalks up some outrageous statistics on his way to a hat-trick against the Baggies, while Dusan Tadic is more sinner than Saint after spurning chances aplenty. Elsewhere, Robert Snodgrass shows the benefits of a central role under his new manager and we check in on the impressive figures being produced by Arsenal’s overlooked wide man.

Paul Is certain he won't make the same mistakes next season. Follow them on Twitter

1,984 Comments Post a Comment
  1. ♤TeddyBear♤
    • 9 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Was tonight a good night for DGW purposes?

    2 prem teams through

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    1. TorresMagic™
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      More chance for blanks/DGWs.

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      1. Sonny “The Hitman&rdq…
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        So not good

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  2. Postman Ty
    • 9 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Typical player on my team. Benteke tries to ruin me in the league and gets a super sub brace in the cup. Score in the freakin league mate.

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    1. Hooky
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      He's not going to be up against David Wheater in the PL unfortunately

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      1. Postman Ty
        • 9 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Swansea ain't much better, to be fair.

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        1. Hooky
          • 9 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Bambi is more coordinated than Wheater. Swansea are bad but not that bad.

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  3. FPL Puppy
    • 8 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Does anyone have a link to Luke's team? (The guy that's currently on the Scoutcast. 🙂 )

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    1. Hooky
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      47307 team ID

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  4. Morgs
    • 8 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Serious amount of love for Lukaku on tonight's Scoutcast... Do I need to be trying to fit him in here?

    Grant
    Alonso / Rose / Baines
    Sanchez / Haz / Alli / Phillips
    Ibra / Kane / Defoe

    (Mannone, Davies, Amat, 3.9)

    0.0itb 0FT

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    1. vatsalgandhi
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      I would try and fit him in for the upcoming fixtures. Maybe flip Haz and Defoe for Lukaku and someone else.

      btw s/o to Bonobo (pic)

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  5. Rolls-Royce
    • 10 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premier-league/2017/01/17/31653492/mike-dean-demoted-to-championship?ICID=HP_BN_2

    Bad news for FPL, good news for PL.

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  6. Jigger & Pony
    • 10 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    If Palace beat City in the next round of the FA Cup we will have a Spurs DGW following a GW28 blank.

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    1. TorresMagic™
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Can't both lose in Rd 5?

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  7. Dušan Citizen
    • 10 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Is there a chance for some DGW/blank GW 24 or 26 like QPR and Villa had it 2 seasons ago?

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    1. Dušan Citizen
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      THANKS AGAIN

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    2. Morgs
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Nobody knows this information yet

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    3. RedLightning
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 13 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      The GW26 matches for the League Cup finalists will have to be rearranged, but it is more likely that at least one of them will still be played in GW26 (in midweek) than that they will be brought forward.

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      1. Jimmers
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Isn't CL on that midweek? So games can't clash

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        1. RedLightning
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • Has Moderation Rights
          • 13 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          No Champions League or Europa League that midweek, so it's free for rearranged matches.

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  8. dunas_dog
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 8 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Been trying to create balanced team for next few week.How does this look and how best to improve? Leaves .1 m in bank

    Heaton Jakupovic
    Alonso Baines Brunt Friend Collins
    Sanchez Eriksen Coutinho Phillips De Roon
    Zlatan Kane Lukaku

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    1. 1NVINCIBLES
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Amazing team!

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    2. myboycharlie
      • 12 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Serious team

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    3. Hurricane Gilbert
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Sick team. No wc?

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    4. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Not sold on Coutinho yet...just back from injury, 'pool fixtures not great.

      Since you have a spare Spurs slot, Alli will do you better.

      If not, no Spurs defender. Rose/Walker should be in there ahead of Brunt, certainly.

      Finances don't look great for any of the above though

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      1. dunas_dog
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 8 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Could have Alli if Collins becomes Love

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    5. ⚽️ Dingo ⚽️
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      What's your rank?

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      1. dunas_dog
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 8 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        45,000 but climbing up the rankings in last few weeks

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  9. Torres76
    • 14 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    With regards to Giroud:

    1. Sell
    2. Keep

    Thanks

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    1. COLLIN QUANER
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Keep for another week at least

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    2. TorresMagic™
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Wait for news.

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    3. Werkself
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 11 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      If I had to decide this second I'd sell.

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    4. dunas_dog
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Wait but have plan to move if necessary on Friday

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  10. Torres76
    • 14 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Pick one please:

    1. Eriksen
    2. Coutinho

    Thanks

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    1. dunas_dog
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Eriksen as hard fixtures for Coutinho post Swansea game

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  11. COLLIN QUANER
    • 7 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    My front 8

    Erikson (mci) Stanislas (WAT) Sanchez (BUR) Pedro (HUL) Phillips (SUN)
    Giroud (BUR) Ibra (stk) Costa (HUL)

    If we assume Costa starts at the weekend, who would you drop?

    The fixtures are perfect for AoA but unfortunately already used

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    1. Dušan Citizen
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Stanislas

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  12. Torres76
    • 14 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Best three for Spurs

    1. Walker
    2. Rose
    3. Eriksen
    4. Ali
    5. Kane

    Tempted to go 3,4 and 5

    Thoughts?

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    1. KISSES
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Gotta get a fullback in there

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    2. dunas_dog
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Rose Alli Kane

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    3. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Rose, Eriksen, Kane

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    4. Cok3y5murf
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Eriksen, Rose and choose one between Alli and Kane

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  13. Captain Vantastic™
    • 12 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Worth considering Stanislas? He never really completes 90 minutes but has two good fixtures coming up. Thoughts on Siggy to Stanislas?

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    1. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Yes

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    2. Shipstontrev
      • 14 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Now he has penalties, I'd say yes.

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      1. TopMarx
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • Has Moderation Rights
        • 11 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Wilson has penalties I think.... he didn't play last match so why Stan took it

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  14. KISSES
    • 10 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Costa and Eriksen

    or

    Kane and Pedro

    I see the second option as safe this weekend in case Costa given a reprimand benching.

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    1. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      First

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  15. Torres76
    • 14 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Best front three:

    1. Ibra
    2. Kane
    3. Costa

    4. Giroud
    5. Defoe
    6. Crouch

    I am thinking 1, 2 and 4 because of the Costa uncertainty.

    Cheers

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    1. dunas_dog
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      1,2 and 5 from your choices but I would go Lukaku over Defoe

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  16. Back on the horse
    • 13 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    What shall I do with these 2 FT?

    Heaton Grant
    Alonso Friend Lovren Williams Holebas
    Antonio Lallana Philips Sanchez Hazard
    Kane Ibra Anichebe
    0.0

    don't want to get rid of Haz before Hull and dont have enough money to do anything with ANichebe so I'll jsut bench him.

    Shall I
    a) sort Holebas out this week? Funes Mori? Evans? Nyoms?
    b) Heaton to Robles?
    c) leave it
    d) other

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    1. TorresMagic™
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Tricky one. You already have Williams.
      Sell Heaton might work if Everton do well but I'd rather Baines etc.

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    2. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Probably A. Need to get Anichebe out but you cant. Try to plan for that next GW though.

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    3. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Save FT this week

      Next week, liquidate Hazard, convert to Eriksen/Alli, probably turn Lallana into Coutinho

      Longer term, drop Lovren and Holebas...buy an uber-cheap 5th defender, buy Rose/Walker.

      If you get chance, convert Williams to Baines...maybe before the above.

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  17. juanmata8
    • 9 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Whom should I play? Other defenders are Brunt & Baines

    A. Rose vs MCI(A)
    B. Daniels vs WAT(H)
    C. Chambers vs WHU(H)

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    1. TLF
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      If you are planning to play 3 I'd bench Chambers as I reckon West Ham will score. I'd play Brunt over Baines (contraversial I know) if Brunt is playing as a midfielder but if not then Baines it is.

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      1. juanmata8
        • 9 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        I am planning to play baines and brunt and would have to play one among the A B C as the third defender.
        Basically the question will be to play Daniels or Rose?

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    2. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      C
      B
      A

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  18. Lav
    • 7 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Now that Costa has returned am I GTG?
    1 FT 0 ITB

    Foster
    Alonso - Cedric - Friend
    Sanchez(c) - Haz - Erik - Stanislas
    Ibra - Costa - Rondon

    Pick - de Roon - Hole - Ake

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  19. Hurricane Gilbert
    • 8 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Watching MOTD highlights. Middlesborough were really lucky to not concede.

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    1. Je suis le chat
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      How did Friend play, any attacking threat?

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      1. Hurricane Gilbert
        • 8 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Not in this game. Reckon he pushes forward and is more attacking at home.

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  20. Ibracadebruyne
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 8 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Presume they all play and bench one this GW...

    Philips, Sanchez, Stanislas, Lallana, Coutinho

    Costa, Ibra, Giroud

    Cheers!

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    1. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Coutinho

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    2. Sess!
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 13 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Can only be stanislas

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      1. Lav
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Really? Home to Watford? Double Liverpool away to City? I think one will do.

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        1. Sess!
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 13 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Liverpool are at home to Swansea. The team that's conceding the most goals in the league.

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          1. Lav
            • 7 Years
            7 years, 5 months ago

            Its Spurs v City got my fixtures mixed up.

            I agree Stanislas it isx

            Sorry.

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            1. Sess!
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • 13 Years
              7 years, 5 months ago

              No worries. He's got a tough choice but if assuming all fit as he asks I think he's the one you'd kick yourself least about if you bench and he scores well.

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  21. Gerci
    • 8 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Forster Pickford
    Baines Alonso Holebas Barragan Amat
    Hazard Sanchez Lallana Phillips Allen
    Ibra Kane Wilson

    2FT 2.1 ITB

    Any ideas? Thinking of Allen -> Mirallas

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    1. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Wilson out or Wilson + Allen out

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      1. Sess!
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Wilson wI'll prob play this week tho

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        1. Lav
          • 7 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Yeah but its not certain. Hes always a rotation risk. Depending on who he can get I would upgrade him.

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          1. Sess!
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • 13 Years
            7 years, 5 months ago

            Yeah I tend to agree

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    2. Sess!
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 13 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      If you're shipping Allen I'd get eriksen

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    3. scootadee
      • 8 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      wilson -> crouch
      allen -> eriksen
      3-5-2?

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      1. Sess!
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Yeah this. Wilson might burn you this week that'd only worry.

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  22. upthemiddle
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 14 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Rarely seek advice but sure why not. Have 2 FT, used 1 to bring in Phillips for Sigurdsson.

    Team in full is:

    Heaton / Pickford

    Alonso / Holebas / McAuley / Adam Smith / Pieters

    Alli / Allen / Sanchez / Phillips / Capoue

    Kane / Ibra / Carroll

    Have 2.8 ITB. Can either upgrade the defense, bringing in the likes of Rose or Baines for Holebas/Smith or I'd quite like to bring in a Liverpool midfielder (Coutinho) but to afford that I'd need to make a 3rd transfer

    A. Holebas -> Baines

    B.
    Allen -> Coutinho
    Capoue -> Davies

    C.
    Allen -> Lallana

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    1. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      That midfield is a mess. Capoue has to go. If you are willing to take a hit add Allen to the list as well. What other options can you go with besides B for the midfield?

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      1. Sess!
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        I didn't even spot Allen!

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    2. Sess!
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 13 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      No need to make a defensive transfer this week when you can play Alonso, McCauley and Smith. I'd prioritise ditching Carroll.

      Carroll > Lukaku
      Capoue > T Carroll

      If that gives enough funds. Capoue is a dead asset now. Just get cheapest playing option in at 5th mid. Downgrading holebas another option to raise funds for Lukaku. Giroud another option if fit. You can prob get him with one trade.

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      1. Sess!
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        What about:

        Allen > Coutinho
        Capoue > Eriksen
        Carroll > Crouch
        -4

        Does that work?

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        1. Lav
          • 7 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Think it would be -8. He used one already Siggy to Phillips.

          Looks tempting though if he could do it.

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          1. Sess!
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • 13 Years
            7 years, 5 months ago

            Ha, I really should read posts fully.

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            1. upthemiddle
              • Fantasy Football Scout Member
              • 14 Years
              7 years, 5 months ago

              Is Crouch a long-term fixture and would I be just chasing points there.

              Think we all agree that Capoue & Allen need to go although the former only cost me 4.5. I could possibly bring in Pedro as another option but would he's a rotation risk.

              I have Alli, don't like doubling up on clubs in the same position.

              0.1 shy to bring in Tom Carroll & Lukaku for Capoue & Lukaku. Balls!

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  23. Erez Avni
    • 7 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    g2g for gw?

    valdes
    brunt mustafi aspi (pieters wilson)
    ali sanchez lallana pedro (c) phillips
    ibra lukaku (gray)

    cheers

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    1. TorresMagic™
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      gtg

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      1. Erez Avni
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        cheers

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    2. Hurnt
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Pedro captain looks dangerous good luck

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      1. Erez Avni
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        sanchez is the right way ha

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    3. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Might've clung to my Sanchez(c) safety blanket, otherwise looks good

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      1. Erez Avni
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        cheers

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  24. Hurnt
    • 10 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Hi all

    What should my next move be? Help appreciated

    Grant
    Peiters Kosc Pjones
    Hazard Sanchez lallana Philips
    Giroud Ibra Kane

    Pickford Amat carrick love

    0.6ITB

    1FT

    OR 186k

    Thinking peiters to Williams for a free will wait for giroud news

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  25. Twelve years a slave
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 13 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Costa should have lost his yellow flag.
    Back training with team

    Usuall selective nonsense when it comes to flags

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    1. Sess!
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 13 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Yeah it's ultra annoying when he's going to drop tonight. No consistency to flags at all. Obviously people running it sold him this week.

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      1. Twelve years a slave
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Maybe the ones who orchestrated the big sell off dont want to admit he is back

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  26. M.A.G
    • 7 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    If i have Alonso/Rose/Brunt
    Do i need to get in Baines ? he has awesome fixtures and attacking threat to but i can't justify ditching anyone of my main defenders

    any thought guys ?

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    1. Lav
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      If you have Foster I would do it and take Brunt out.

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      1. M.A.G
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        nope , brunt is my only cover

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    2. TorresMagic™
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 15 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      If you think those 3 outscore him then no.

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    3. Sess!
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 13 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Brunt is very exciting at LB. One to monitor.

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      1. Sess!
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 13 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        *isn't

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        1. M.A.G
          • 7 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Yes , that's one of the things that 's been bothering me + west brom isn't tight at the back like last year
          he is the one to go if i decide to get baines/coleman i guess

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          1. Sess!
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • 13 Years
            7 years, 5 months ago

            Might have to change your username 😉

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            1. M.A.G
              • 7 Years
              7 years, 5 months ago

              That's what i thought 😆

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    4. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      I'd swap for Brunt personally.

      Even though WBA have good fixtures, they're cack at keeping clean sheets...you'll be relying more on assists and free kicks for points.

      Everton fixtures even nicer, loads of assist potential, plus penalties...for only half a million more...no contest 🙂

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      1. M.A.G
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Yup , the lack of CS is a big factor and big concern and that may swing it for me i guess

        what do you think about Coleman vs Baines ?
        Coleman is a bigger attacking threat but Baines has penalties who would you go for ?

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        1. My Name Is Prince
          • 11 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Yep, Brunt ain't the new Baines after all 😀

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  27. Richd
    • 11 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Guys I have 0.0mill in the bank but two frees. I just don't know what to do !

    Heaton , Robinson
    Alonso, pieters, Holebas, Amat, Taylor
    Sanchez, haz, lallana, Phillips, de roon
    Aguero, ibra, benteke

    Don't wanna offload hazard before the weekend. Probably need some spurs after this weekend too.

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    1. Licious Lizard
      • 11 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Make a defensive transfer and save 2nd FT and be prepared if you want to ship Hazard and spend the extra cash.

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    2. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Flush Benteke down the toilet...

      Maybe get Rondon as straight replacement.

      Otherwise get Crouch in, use the surplus to upgrade DeRoon...you can get Pedro in for that money

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      1. Business Cat
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 9 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        You'd then be wanting to convert Hazard into Eriksen/Alli the week after.

        Then invest that surplus into the ropey defence 🙂

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    3. badgerboy
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Holebas/Pieters - Boro defender, Chambers/Friend.

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    4. kalmoffit
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Taylor to Holgate?

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  28. Licious Lizard
    • 11 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Grant + Siggy + Carroll --> Jaku + Tom Davies + Lukaku for -8?

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  29. BremerHB
    • 7 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    A) Baines
    B) Rose/Walker?

    Playing in a def of:
    Foster
    Brunt - Alonso - XXX
    Bench: (Pieters, Amat) with Jones currently, probably the one to get transferred out.

    Which would you pick and would you also transfer out for Jones?

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    1. My Name Is Prince
      • 11 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      I'd go A based on Baines being cheaper and Verts being injured, which means we can't be that certain of Spurs defense perhaps... Will they go back to 4 at the back?

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      1. BremerHB
        • 7 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Hmm interesting thought. More to ponder!

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  30. My Name Is Prince
    • 11 Years
    7 years, 5 months ago

    Vertonghen injured... Is that the last nail in the coffin in the case of Baines over Rose?

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    1. Kiwivillan
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 10 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Not sure how relevant

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      1. My Name Is Prince
        • 11 Years
        7 years, 5 months ago

        Surely Spurs defense is more solid with him than without him?

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        1. Sess!
          • Fantasy Football Scout Member
          • 13 Years
          7 years, 5 months ago

          Maybe a little bit but wouldn't think huge difference. Only worry is if they revert to four at back.

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          1. M.A.G
            • 7 Years
            7 years, 5 months ago

            That's the biggest concern , i can't see wimmer / davies fitting in 3ATB imo

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          2. My Name Is Prince
            • 11 Years
            7 years, 5 months ago

            Not a huge difference, but enough to get convinced to get Baines instead I reckon... Or not 😀

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    2. M.A.G
      • 7 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      they 'll keep getting clean sheets but the attacking threat of Rose/Walker 'll be a little less i guess , as they will turn back to 4 at the back formations , tough call tho

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    3. Business Cat
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • 9 Years
      7 years, 5 months ago

      Wimmer was good last time Vertonghen was out for a whike.

      It's Toby who's the defender who brings stability, not Vert.

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