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In Search Of The Best Fantasy Football Formation

BenCrabtree was crowned Fantasy Premier League champion for e 2016/17 season, with an impressive score of 2564  by mainly using a 3-4-3 formation. Often this involved rotating the third defender spot between a trio of low priced centre backs and full backs.

This was a popular strategy among last season’s top managers, who also were flexible enough to opt for 3-5-2 when strong third striker options dried up.

This analysis will explore to what extent 3-4-3 is essential to a successful FPL season, with a goal of finding the best formation that can get closest to Ben’s title winning average  Gameweek score of 67.5.

Method

To do this I calculated every players’ average points per game (PPG). Then excluded anyone with less than 15 games as an attempt to avoid outliers.

Next I focused on creating price brackets. I ended up with three levels for Goal Keepers (Low, Medium, High), and five for the other positions (Bargain, Low, Medium, High, Elite)

I then looked at the prices by position, to come up with an even spread across the price brackets.  Once I had the brackets defined I used several players with prices immediately above and below the bracket price, ensuring that the average price of the selected players was close to my bracket price.

For example with goalkeepers the brackets are 4.5, 5 and 5.5.   To determine the average points for the 4.5 position I used players with prices from 4.3 (Hennessey) all the way up to 4.8 (Mignolet). The average price was 4.55 which was close enough. In total 14 players fell within that price range and the average of their PPG was of 3.6

Goalkeepers

BracketPricePoints Per Game
Low£4.53.6
Medium£53.7
High£5.54.0

Defenders

BracketPricePoints Per Game
Bargain£4.52.6
Low£53.1
Medium£5.53.6
High£63.9
Elite£6.54.5

Admittedly there was a very small sample size at the 6.5 range, just 6 players.

Midfielders

BracketPricePoints Per Game
Bargain£4.52.8
Low£63.3
Medium£7.54.0
High£94.5
Elite£10.55.9

Forwards

BracketPricePoints Per Game
Bargain£52.6
Low£6.53.7
Medium£83.9
High£9.54.2
Elite£115.9

Finding The Optimal Line Up

I tried to come up with a mathematical formula that would give me the optimal line up, but my maths is not up to that level of sophistication, so I decided to crack it with a sledge hammer instead. After a few Google searches I managed to teach myself enough Visual Basic to enable me to write some script that did the following:

For each valid starting line-up, determine every possible permutation of player positions and price, ensure the total of the player prices are within the budget and sum up the team points, save the line up which has the most points. I varied the budgets based on the types of players that would be on the bench.

The assumption being that benched GK are 4.5, Def and Mid are 4.75 and Forwards are 6.0   I also included an additional formations where the third forward was classed as bench fodder at 5.0   I also limited the number of elite defenders to a maximum of four players due to there being so few of them.

The code also takes into account the captaincy, it takes the player position with the highest PPG and captains that position, so basically just doubles his points. It does not take into account any other game chips.

The Caveats

There several caveats that I’m already aware of

  1. I’m using the end of season prices for players. Generally the better performing players will have higher prices at the end of the season than they had at the start of the season, but I’m using the start of the season budget amount of £100m. I’m trying to achieve a score close to the winning teams but in all likelihood they will have better total points because they picked up players before their prices increased and they have a significantly higher end of season budget.

What this analysis should do though, is give the best overall formation regardless of whether it can compare with the overall winner’s score.

  1. There is no rotation taken into account. For example when using the 3-4-3 formation last season’s winner managed to garner significant points from his low budget defenders by correctly picking the player who would excel on each given week. Turning three budget defenders into the equivalent of an elite defender requires a lot of skill and a fair amount of luck. With a large sample size of four million Fantasy Premier League managers  it’s not unthinkable that a few people get it right for a high percentage of the season.  It’s probably a prerequisite for making the top 1,000 in the rankings.
  2. Form. With all the players used in the analysis I took their average points per game. It’s an average of their good weeks and their bad weeks. However, a Fantasy manager has the ability to guess when a player’s form will take a hit, due to knowing the upcoming schedule, transferring him out for another player with a better schedule and hopefully better form to come. Similar to the rotation comment above the more successful managers will be the ones that correctly predict a change in form and transfer in players about to go on a good run of games whilst transferring out players before a bad run starts.

With a  four million sample size there are going to be some managers who optimise points by correctly predicting form. This analysis does not cater for form

  1. The average points are used for the price bracket, not the highest points, managers correctly selecting the top performers in the price bracket will optimise their scores above and beyond the scores produced by this analysis.
  2. This analysis assumes that you can field a full team every week with the positions that are identified. For example if the formation states you need an elite midfielder that will score on average 5.9 PPG, then you need to field an elite midfielder in that position for 38 GWs. If that elite midfielder misses games and has to be replaced by your bench guy who only scores 2.8 PPG then you’re not going to be able to maintain a season long average. Of course if a player gets an injury then you can replace them with another similar elite player, it’s more an issue relating to random weekly benching, as we often see with the teams playing in Europe.

Given all the caveats it’s fair to assume there are more factors influencing my results being a lower score than a higher score.

380 million permutations were evaluated. (3x5x5x5x5x5x5x5x5x5x5x13). Taking 4 hours to process.

The Best and Worst Formations Are…

Here are the results in highest PPG order

FormationTeam PPG
532x56.5
52356.2
442x55.9
43355.8
53255.7
541x55.7
44255.5
54155.3
352x55.1
34355.1
45154.9
35254.6

(where x signifies the benched forward is £5m compared to £6m)

There is only a two point difference between the best formation 5-3-2x and the worst formation 3-5-2.   It’s interesting to see that the worst formation was 3-5-2, which was used by many successful managers at the end of last season, whilst 3-4-3, the most successful formation overall, was third from bottom on the list.

This tells me that the bench (rotation) must play a significant part in the overall score.

The optimal line up for 532x was:

PositionBracketPricePPG
GKLow£4.53.6
DEF1Elite£6.54.5
DEF2Elite£6.54.5
DEF3Elite£6.54.5
DEF4Elite£6.54.5
DEF5High£6.03.9
MID1 ©Elite£10.55.9 + 5.9
MID2Elite£10.55.9
MID3Elite£10.55.9
FWD1Low£6.53.7
FWD2Low£6.53.7
Total£8156.5

In terms of the objective, which was to try and determine an optimal lineup that compared favourably with the winning score these results are 11 points too low. But these based on average players at the price range. When we substitute in actual players with high PPG in the price ranges, you get this a more comparable figure

PositionBracketPlayerPricePPG
GKLowJakupovic HUL£4.33.9
DEF1EliteAlonso CHE£6.95.7
DEF2EliteCahill CHE£6.74.8
DEF3EliteKompany MCI£6.05.2
DEF4EliteRose TOT£5.84.7
DEF5HighValencia MUN£5.84.3
MID1 ©EliteSánchez ARS£11.76.9 + 6.9
MID2EliteHazard CHE£10.56.2
MID3EliteEriksen TOT£8.96.1
FWD1LowDefoe SUN£7.44.5
FWD2LowLlorente SWA£6.34.4
Total£80.363.6

The recommended 532x formation was based on the average PPG across several players, but there were two players last season that were outliers, Junior Stanislas of Bournemouth and Spurs striker Harry Kane. If we switch the formation by replacing an elite mid with a bargain mid and a low forward with an elite forward we get this.

PositionBracketPlayerPricePPG
GKLowJakupovic HUL£4.33.9
DEF1EliteAlonso CHE£6.95.7
DEF2EliteCahill CHE£6.74.8
DEF3EliteKompany MCI£6.05.2
DEF4EliteRose TOT£5.84.7
DEF5HighValencia MUN£5.84.3
MID1EliteSánchez ARS£11.76.9
MID2EliteHazard CHE£10.56.2
MID3LowStanislas BOU£4.65.1
FWD1©EliteKane TOT£11.97.5 + 7.5
FWD2LowLlorente SWA£6.34.4
Total£80.566.2

66.2 PPG gives 2516 points per season, which would be fifth in the FPL Overall Ranking.

The flaw is that this uses average weekly points and assumes the players will play for 38 games.

Looking at players in similar prices ranges to the recommended 5-3-2x formation, who played a lot of games and use their total season’s points we get this.

PositionBracketPlayerPriceSeason PtsWeeks
GKLowBoruc BOU£4.512035
DEF1EliteCahill CHE£6.717837
DEF2EliteAlonso CHE£6.917731
DEF3EliteColeman EVE£5.613326
DEF4EliteWalker TOT£6.214233
DEF5HighBaines EVE£5.813532
MID1 ©EliteSánchez ARS£11.7264 + 26438
MID2EliteHazard CHE£10.522437
MID3LowAlli TOT£9.122537
FWD1EliteDefoe SUN£7.416633
FWD2LowLlorente SWA£6.314637
Total£80.7

Assuming that when a player doesn’t play, a bench player will contribute 2.5 points.

Total Points = 2174 + 108 bench points = 2282

This team if left unattended for the season, with decent bench, would have finished in the top 17,000.

Conclusion

I don’t think that the formation is a key differentiator, success is more dependent on player selection and timing, transferring in players as they are about to hit form, getting lucky with captaincy and the making good bench rotation decisions.

What I’m taking from this analysis is that you can really use any formation you like the look of and still be successful, as long as you utilise your bench correctly.

So for the start of the season I’m going with the following line-up, my rotation will be concentrated around all the defenders and the four 6.0 priced midfielders. The aim is to rotate the best seven players from the nine focusing on home fixtures and weak opponents.

The best for 2017/18 could be a mixture of 5-3-2 and 4-4-2.

GKLow£4.53.6
DEF1Elite£6.54.5
DEF2Elite£6.54.5
DEF3Medium£5.53.6
DEF4Medium£5.53.6
DEF5Medium£5.53.6
MID1Elite£10.55.9
MID2Low£63.3
MID3Low£63.3
FWD1Elite£115.9
FWD2Elite£115.9
Bench
GKLow£4.53.6
MID2Low£63.3
MID2Low£63.3
FWDBargain£50.0

After some quick analysis of the defenders and midfields schedules, I believe I can attain 60% home fixture for the defenders and an 80% home fixture for the midfielders, with most fixtures being against teams in the bottom half of the table.

88 Comments Post a Comment
  1. J0E
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 14 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Thanks for this...there is increasing talk of going 4 or even 5 at the back this season due to high prices of attackers. This certainly adds to that debate.

  2. Eze Really?
    • 9 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Quite clear last year premium defenders similar price to mids and forwards offer better value. A nice article!

  3. ★Kuntheman★
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Love this as someone who's playing 4-5-1

    1. ★Kuntheman★
      • 8 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Well, a 4-5-1+4-4-2 hybrid

  4. StalkingDwarf
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    This could be the year to spend big on the back. With the high amount of expensive attackers from top teams, along with the increasing number of wingbacks and attacking defenders, I'm thinking about starting the game with a 4-4-2. I'm not ballsy enough to go for a 5-3-2 though.

  5. Waxys
    • 7 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    3-4-3 is historically the most popular formation and with good reason it's usually much harder for defenders to score points than it is for attacking players.

    the stats support this with an overwhelming 75% of the top 50 opting for a 3-4-3 formation.

    Despite this in recent times an increase in the amount of successful players has taken place, using other formations such as the next most popular 3-5-2.

    3-4-3 continues to remain a staple for EPL managers and will likely stand the test of time. However that is not to say other formations should not be considered.

  6. FPL Sergeant
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 14 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Id like to see the projected points based on your 532 with two Elite forwards. Having flirted with 343 & 352 last year Im considering a 442 with the WB system becoming more prevalent.

  7. Slam
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Thing is, will there be 4 6.0 mids?
    Stanislas, Redmond, who else?

    1. firetog
      • 7 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      If I WC after week 7 this is sort of how I see the Mids working.

      Using FF Fix projection prices
      Coutinho (LIV) £9m
      Ritchie (NEW) £6m
      Phillips (WBA) £6.5m (week 1 to 3) then Lanzini £6.5m (week 4 to 7) - we now know he's £7m
      Ward Prowse (Sou) £5.5m
      Stanislas (BOU) £6.5m

      Rotation need 3 or 4 from those 5
      Week1 LIV(wat), WBA(BOU), SOU(SWA)
      Week2 LIV(CRY), SOU(WHU), BOU(WAT)
      Week3 LIV(ARS), NEW(WHU), WBA(STK), BOU(MCI)
      Week4 LIV(mci), NEW(swa), WHU(HUD), SOU(WAT)
      Week5 LIV(BUR), NEW(STK), SOU(cry), BOU(BRI)
      Week6 LIV(lei), WHU(TOT), SOU(MUN),
      Week7 NEW(LIV), WHU(SWA), BOU(LEI)

      There's only 5 away games out of 24 and 3 of them are easy (wat, cry, swa)
      week 6 is a bit tough but the others are better than average.

  8. abreu
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 14 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Most interesting article I've read for a while ☺

  9. bojack
    • 7 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Excellent article, thank you.

  10. Ógie
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 11 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Great work Firetog.

    It certainly gives one food for thought.

  11. The Tinkerman
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    I tried 4 at the back last season with 3 premium defenders (442).

    It went very badly and I needed a few hits to reverse the gamble. Seems I just picked a bad time to do it (at the start of the season, teams kept very few clean sheets during this period for some reason). Still think the formation is workable, but as with any formation it's reliant on who you choose to fill the slots.

    But given there are very few premium defenders, you have a higher probability of selecting the right ones in the 6.5m DEF slots, I guess.

    1. J0E
      • Fantasy Football Scout Member
      • Has Moderation Rights
      • 14 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      looking at fixtures a Baily Lindelof double up supplemented by a choice of two of three others could work out....

      Squeezing in Kane and Lukaku is going to be tough.

      1. Doosra - ☭DeclanMyGeniusâ…
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 14 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        How much is Bailly?

        1. La Roja
          • 12 Years
          6 years, 9 months ago

          Sechs

          1. Doosra - ☭DeclanMyGeniusâ…
            • Fantasy Football Scout Member
            • 14 Years
            6 years, 9 months ago

            Ta. Ouch.

  12. Clintymints
    • 14 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    This is pretty impressive

  13. Cantona's Kung Fu Kick
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    What happens when the only 6.0 MF are from teams that don't score goals?

    1. firetog
      • 7 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Its a good point, I'm hoping to find 4 or 5 of them. But the alternative is cheap defenders on shitty teams or cheap forwads on those same teams as the midfielders. With this budget limitation you have to cut back somewhere.

  14. Matamatics
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Great article - I am taking a gamble and going for 4-4-2. I think attacking defenders offer great value for money in general due to the added bonus of clean sheet points as well. With attacking defenders like Milner (on pens and should be reclassified), Kolasinac and Alonso going big at the back and shifting formations may be worth the punt.

    1. Eze Really?
      • 9 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Thinking the same since teams adopted 3 at the back. The trouble is, there is always a King/Kane/Mahrez that pop their head out. What I am doing is the Mid/Forward fodder will always be my third reserve.

      1. Matamatics
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 8 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        Just seeing Milner confirmed as a defender at 6.5 reiterates my point here. He would have matched Coutinho if he was a defender last year due to being on penalties and he will definitely be in my team.

        With the players that emerge you have to be on them quick and if they are cheap you should have the funds to bring them in, grab those all important price rises and therefore increase your team value so you have more money for those later wildcards. If they lose form then sell them, those that got on and off the Capoue wagon quickly gained 0.5 million in team value

  15. Ghost Gooner
    • 10 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    I'm going 442/352 from the start. Until the 3rd striker spot becomes clear (llorente, benteke, austin, gabbi, iheanacho) I'm steering clear of 343.

    Hudderfield 4.5/4 =8.5

    Kompany 6 Stephens 5 Evans 4.5
    Olsson 4.5 Rosenior 4 =24

    Ozil 9 Pogba 8 Zaha 7.5 Lanzini 7
    Redmond 6.5 =38

    Kane 13 Aguero 12 B/F 4.5
    =29

  16. Slam
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Blimey, I barely skimmed through it when I made my first comment.
    After reading it through I've deduced this is really impressive stuff mate, fantastic work.

  17. Our Tiny Windows
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 7 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    This looks suspiciously like the alogorithm said two low priced forwards is the optimum but you've settled for two elite!

    1. firetog
      • 7 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      I did. As I mentioned:

      "What I’m taking from this analysis is that you can really use any formation you like the look of and still be successful, as long as you utilise your bench correctly.

      So for the start of the season I’m going with the following line-up, my rotation will be concentrated around all the defenders and the four 6.0 priced midfielders."

      I don't think 2 Low Forwards (+1 bench Fodder) and 3 Elite Mids allows you to rotate very well. How often will you rotate an Elite mid for a Low Mid.

      My conclusion was that the key to success had a lot to do with rotation and less the formation, I'm still taking the recommended formation 5-3-2x, but tweaking the proposed lineup to allow for more flexible rotation. So I'm switching the Elite Mids for Elite Forwards (Price and Points are comparable), I'm switching the Low Forwards for Low Mids. Prices are comparable, but Low mids score a little less, I'm hoping home fixtures (80%) and weak opponents makes up the points difference.

      In order to have 2 bench Mids that are at 6m, I've had to lower the quality of 3 Defenders from 6.5 to 5.5, but I think there will be some reasonable 5.5 players with a good run of fixtures. Like Southampton for the first couple of months, then I'll switch them out for another team with good fixtures.
      That's the plan, it'll probably all go horribly wrong by week 5 but at the end of day luck also plays a significant role.

  18. Andy_Social
    • 11 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Very brave - what about something like this:

    5-3-2
    Begovic (4.5), 4.0 8.5

    Valencia (6.5), Moses (6.5), Milner (6.5), Cedric (5.5), Trippier (5.5) 30.5

    Sane (8.5), Pedro (8.5), Lanzini (7.0), 4.5, 4.5 33.0

    Kane (12.5), Lukaku (11.0) 4.5 28.0

    1. FPL Belfast
      • 8 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Looks a cracking team

      1. Prismism
        • 7 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        None of the bench will be nailed.

    2. FC Lackless [BALEGIUM]
      • 7 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Fear Kaku will be more than 11m .... that would probably be my defence too if I played five at the back

  19. Swedish Rs Mafia
    • 7 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    I tried for two years to use statistics like these to form the optimal formation.
    1. Fill your team 11 with the highest point scorers for last year.
    2. Remove the worst PPG/Price (Value per game) player and replace him with the highest PPG/Price player.
    3. Repeat step 2 until the team value is less than 100 - keeping formation rules into account.

    You end up with a lot of money invested in defence (Ivanovic etc). However, this is very theoretical and in my experience does not take enough of the actual game into account. There are many reasons for why 5-3-2 is not going to workout that well in the end....

    1. Andy_Social
      • 11 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      That gets you this;

      Forster 5.0 + 4.0
      Azpi 6.5, Cahill 7.0 McAuley 5.0 Daniels 5.5 Alonso 7.0
      Zaha 6.5, Alli 9.5, Siggy 7.5, Eriksen 9.0 Capoue 5.5
      Llorente 7.0, Defoe 8.0, Deeney 7.0

      It would score well over 2500 points.

      1. Andy_Social
        • 11 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        Ah, well yes and no. I forgot to leave players on the bench. On the other hand if I went for 11 I'd have higher scoring guys like Lukaku.

  20. Bambi
    • 12 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    I feel that this year may be the year for 4-4-2 given the value presented in defenders and cheap premium mids

    -8.5
    - Milner (6.5), Bailly (6.0), Moses (6.5), rotating 2*4.5s
    - Alli (9.5), Mane (9.5), Fabregas (7.0), Stanislas (6.0), 4.5 fodder
    - Kane (12.5), Jesus (10.5), 4.5 fodder

    1. Je suis le chat
      • 10 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Kane will be 13m plus. Good team all the same.

      1. Matamatics
        • Fantasy Football Scout Member
        • 8 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        Thinking similarly, looking at Knockaert as my 6.0 man though. Not sure about Moses I am hoping Dawson may be a cheeky 4.5 if McAuley this year is the more expensive WBA asset. With Southampton's great fixtures I am eyeing up Bertrand (5.5) as a defender in the team too. Hoping there may be a cheaper way into utd's defence too

    2. Andy_Social
      • 11 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Yeah, my formation above with 5 wingbacks is a kind of 0-8-2 🙂

  21. el polako
    • 6 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Last year I changed 343 into 352 and never looked back.
    This year I'm planning to invest bit more in premium defenders (1 from ManU, 1 from Chelsea & Spurs plus Milner). The only worry I've got is wether I will be able to squize in both Lukaku and Kane without compromising my midfield ?
    Do we think that having them both from the start is a must ? Or is there a chance that one of them will not deliver enough goals to justify hefty price tag ?

    BTW great read !

  22. makaveli123
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • 7 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Very interesting read and I appreciate the work put into this! 5 at the back is a no-go for me, but I might play 4-4-2 this season.

  23. pokern1nja09
    • 10 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Best Fpl strategy artical I've ever read! I always been one who has tried to always stick to 343, but this season I'll have an open mind.

  24. tm245
    • 12 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Interesting read, thanks for putting this together, it is quite a read. When looking into the optimal squad, I think sunk costs of our bench spots need to be considered as well. None of these players operate in isolation, they also are a part of a larger squad, of which four spots are routinely not used because they are a bench. Those spots cost a minimum of
    4.0 GK
    4.0 Def 4.0 Def
    4.5 Mid/Fwd
    But most benches are not that lean, and they likely have a total spend of at least 17.5m. So instead of simply calculating the best way to use the 82.5m on 11 starters, could rotation be a factor as well, especially for defenders?

    As an article from earlier this summer pointed out, there is a decently reliable record of CS over the years based on location and fixtures. That being so, a three man rotation of 4.5m players would cost you 13.5m for 3.5-4.0PPG in that one spot if deployed pretty well, considerably outperforming the average on a pure points basis for a Bargain Defender who is never rotated, and also throttling a High Defender for value in terms of PPG/M.

    I know that your piece approached things a bit differently and looked at the sunk costs of a 5-2-3 from other angles, and I don't know if a four or even five man rotation is viable or if it would cause more headaches than it would ease, but I find that the issue of rotation is always an important one to consider when assessing what "value" a defender truly delivers.

    1. firetog
      • 7 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      My conclusion was that successful rotation is essential for success. What I don't know is whether that has to be the rotation of 3 low priced defenders or whether you can successfully rotate a combination of similarly priced defenders and midfielders. I feel that the chance of selecting the right defender from 3 is hard to do and will fail more times than it succeeds My hope is having 9 players (5D and 4M) with an average price of $6m will allow me to optimise home field advantage and weak opponents and will lead to a more consistent weekly average My assumption is that if home field advantage leads to more CS then surely the reverse is true and away games lead to less goals for your offensive players. I'm trying to maximise Home field advantage for 7 of those 9 players. I say 7 because I intend to have one Elite Mid not usually included in the rotation.

      What I would really like to know but dont know have to calculate, is how successful is 343. I know that 75% of the top 50 managers used it. But there were 4 million players, maybe some of the worse players used it too. Maybe the top managers are at the top because they are the best, they pick up the right players at the right time. Maybe they are top regardless of using 343. The analysis indicated there was a 2 point weekly difference across all formations. I'd call it a wash. The best formations could the ones that allow for best use of the bench. 343 and 352 are strong candidates for rotation, as are 532 and 442, but is 343 the must use formation. I'm not sold.

      1. tm245
        • 12 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        Thanks for the reply.

        As for the chance of success with rotation, one way to look at it is that if you get 4 CS in 10 matches from your top pick in a 3 man rotation. That could get you 6 points in 4 matches and 2 points in 6 matches for a total of 36 points, or the 3.6ppg that a 5.5m defender gets, at a cost of 1.0m less.

        I wonder if SmartyPants could help you with the big data question of which formation is most successful. His FPLDiscovery site does some pretty impressive scraping of large samples as well as the top 10k in particular.
        https://fpldiscovery.wordpress.com

  25. FPL Kangaroo
    • 6 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Jesus christ ...I need a lie down after reading that lol.

    1. FPL Kangaroo
      • 6 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      But fairplay Firetog...very interesting read.

  26. RedLightning
    • Fantasy Football Scout Member
    • Has Moderation Rights
    • 13 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    One of your caveats is that you are using end of season prices combined with a start of season budget.
    This means that you cannot afford as many elite forwards and midfielders as if the prices and budget were both taken at the same time of the season.
    Elite defenders are cheaper than elite forwards and midfielders, but elite forwards and midfielders have a far higher ceiling.
    Some of the best forwards and midfielders in the High category may also have a higher ceiling than the elite defenders.
    If you can't afford many Elite or High forwards and midfielders, then formations with a greater number of defenders may come out on top.
    But if you can afford a stronger front seven without ruining your defence then 3-4-3 and 3-5-2 have historically always proved to be better in recent seasons.

    However, every season is different, so the new season's prices and the increasing number of attacking wing-backs still classed as defenders may mean that a different formation such as 4-4-2 might be equally effective if not better this time around, at least until bargain midfielders or forwards emerge who perform better than would be expected at their price.

  27. noquarternt
    • 8 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Excellent article. The world is round, not flat.

  28. wowBOBwow
    • 7 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    As someone who has often played 4 or 5 at the back and spent big on premium defenders I think there is a major problem with the strategy.

    It is VERY hard to know which defenders will score big and when.

    Last year for example Toby and Bellerin were top priced and were fairly average for the year. The top two Cahill and Alonso were not popular initially. You may also have jumped early on guys like Shaw and Clyne and been fairly disappointed. You may have jumped on Azpi or Kos at certain points and then been disappointed.

    The reason is that their attacking returns are very unpredictable and subject to high variance. I owned Toby for much of the season and he had a lot of good chances that he just failed to convert. Kompany meanwhile comes in to the City team and scores from seemingly every corner. Both equally threatening players, but variance was on kompanys side.

    The top scoring defenders by the years end will have had significant attacking returns but they will come at random times. With attacking players their points will be more consistent and predictable. So while in theory having premium defenders who score big is potentially better than owning mid priced mids and forwards, you need to catch their attacking returns which is almost pure luck. Like I said, Toby had a great season last year in terms of attacking threat but just didn't convert like he did the previous season. If 3 or 4 chances went his way it's as much as 30 points difference to his total score which is huge. Being saddled with failing premium defenders is extremely frustrating and then you are terrified to move them on and miss their upcoming hauls.

    My advice would be to start with a relatively cheap defence and then gradually upgrade to anyone who looks essential like Alonso did this year. But even then, accept the higher variance of premium defenders.

    1. the cromulent one
      • 11 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      I think this nails the problem perfectly. There may be some correlation between price and returns, but there is high variance. The key is picking the right player at the right time, which takes a lot of luck. At the beginning of the season, it would be nearly impossible to pick the best 5 defenders, elite or not. Same for midfielders & forwards. In order for any formation to work, you have to get the elite midfielders & forwards right, and get the captaincy right. The choice of formation pales in comparison.

    2. Andy_Social
      • 11 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Excellent points, but I'm going to respectfully disagree. You're quite right about players who are unlucky one season and whose luck might turn - that's covered in the recent 'plexiglass' article. But I think that mostly pertains to centre backs coming up for corners etc.
      For me, what's different is the wingback situation. It wasn't an issue this time last year, or until Conte responded to Chelsea's thrashing at Arsenal. His going over to using wingbacks was the game-changer for Chelsea and in time other teams copied, one by one. So we don't see a clear picture in last seasons raw stats, but my feeling is that with the top clubs all starting the season with attacking wingbacks we'll be seeing something new, which is why I'm going to pioneer a 5-premium-wingback formation. I'll probably fall flat on my arse, but if I'm right, I'll clear the field!

      1. Marknlard
        • 14 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        A few seasons ago, I thought 5-3-2 would be a good way to start. Can't remember the reasons, but something to do with the then-new bonus system appearing to play into the hands of the defenders.

        I allowed myself to get drifted away on the FFS tide and went 3-4-3 same as everyone else. It turned out that five at the back was excellent for the first few months.

        So if you have a maverick idea and decent reasons to try, go for it.

    3. tm245
      • 12 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Well said.

  29. Andy_Social
    • 11 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Cheers. I've since noticed that if I switch Pedro for Defoe I can go 5-2-3. It does mean having 3x4.5m midfielders on the bench which gives me very little wiggle room. I'd also like a City wingback (can drop Cedric) if possible.

    1. Andy_Social
      • 11 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      I think I've just invented the 0-0-10 formation! 😉

  30. the cromulent one
    • 11 Years
    6 years, 9 months ago

    Great article. I don't want to seem too critical, because it really is a terrific effort.
    But I do think that your listed caveats invalidate the methodology somewhat. Kudos for highlighting them!
    The correlation between price & returns is more pronounced because the end-off-season prices are used. The players have self-sorted into price tiers based on their returns. If you used the prices from the beginning of the year, there would be weaker correlation between price tiers and returns.
    Even excluding outliers is problematic. At the beginning of the season, we have no idea whether each of our players will get injured, benched, etc. So it is not as if we can reliably select a non-outlier for each of the price tiers, as the outliers are not known initially.
    At the end of the day, the sorting of players into tiers and removing the outliers is done a posteriori, but the analysis of the possible returns is done as if it was known a priori.
    But I don't think that these flaws invalidate the conclusions entirely. You can still rightly claim that formation does not really matter. If you happen to pick average (representative) players for each position and targeted price bracket, then the expected returns are not very different (your analysis yielded only a two-point difference between all possible formations). Far from making this a pointless exercise, it shows that the formation should not be anyone's focus. A two point difference based on formation (which may be exaggerated due to the flaws listed) us still very much in the noise as compared to:
    - fielding a full team
    - minimizing point hits
    - Getting captaincy right
    - acquiring and fielding in-form players.
    - getting the most out of defensive rotations.
    - Luck! Just making the right choices in the targeted price brackets.
    - Luck! What differentiates elite defenders from mid-prices one's are the attacking returns, which are nearly impossible to predict.
    You alluded to just as much. But I don't see how the formation that you are targeting is supported by the analysis.
    I would rather go cheap in defence, and maximize the numbet of elite attackers that I can carry. This gives multiple captain choices each week, with a reasonable chance if hitting a big score.
    Plus, a defensive rotation means not having to spend transfers on defence, when you realize that what you thought was an elite defender is not producing the returns that you expected. You could chase elite defensive returns all season without ever finding them.
    I realize that the strategy that Im targeting is not supported with numbers. Like you, I don't have enough of a stats background to test and prove what I "feel" to be the optimal approach.
    Thanks again for the analysis and the insight, if only to show that any formation should not be anyone's primary focus.

    1. the cromulent one
      • 11 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Holy crap, I didn't think my reply was that long. Apologies!

      1. Marknlard
        • 14 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        I think it's a perfectly cromulent post.

      2. Andy_Social
        • 11 Years
        6 years, 9 months ago

        Hey, I enjoyed it. Gonna challenge it though. I'm willing to accept the overall premis whilst of course recognising that choosing the right players from the outset is not going to be quite right.

        Let's say, for example, the concept of investing in prime defenders is sound. So last season we start with Luke Shaw - turns out to be a mistake so we switch to Valencia. City's defence starts to look wobbly so we change to Chelsea defenders. The thing about having the most expensive defenders is you can change then with 1FT.

        1. the cromulent one
          • 11 Years
          6 years, 9 months ago

          Well, last year I started with double ManU defence. It was fine at first, but after the first 3 gws, it fell apart. Quite the string of disappointment after that. I switched Shaw to Stones after that, which looked brilliant for a week or two, but then became a nightmare. Even in the middle of the season, picking the defender that will give elite returns is still a crapshoot. Elite defenders are elite because of their attacking returns, which are random. If your elite defender isn't producing elite returns, do you pick a different high-priced defender, or do you wait for the returns to materialize?
          My point is that I don't want to spend ANY transfers on defence unless I really have to. Having cheap playing defenders and playing the best 3/5 fixtures each week means the budget and the transfers are all to maximize points from the front seven attackers. Attackers' points are much more regular and predictable, and it's easier to identify whether you've made a bad choice. Transfers should, in my opinion, be used to get the optimal captain most gameweeks. That *should* be a more certain way to maximize points than playing big defender roulette.

    2. tm245
      • 12 Years
      6 years, 9 months ago

      Great reply, Cromulent. Not too long at all.